Mourning
With court days away now, of course some of DH's and my converstations drift to talking about SS18. DH just broke my heart last night though. He said that for him, the only way he can process everything is that his child died 2 years ago. He no longer has his younger son. He is dead.
My heart just shattered but I know what he is saying. It's an unspeakable loss but even more twisted because his son isn't dead, but by DH being dead to his son- he has to react the same.
I told DH that I think he should write a statement for court. Express all the hurt that the court has caused by not holding BM accountable. That he has lost his son, possibly forever due to inactions by this court. That not only has he suffered a great emotional loss but the financial strain would break most families- all in an effort to be allowed to be a parent that is active in their childs life and that is a wrong that will never be able to be made right.
I don't know if our lawyer will let him read it, but I think he should.
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I'm not sure I would feel
I'm not sure I would feel like it was an absolute death... because in that case.. there is zero hope.. but it certainly is a loss of the years and the ongoing uncertainty.
He had to drop the rope to an extent.. but there, of course, is still the chance that some time down the road.. his son will want to reconnect.. when his mom's pull and control is less powerful than it is.
It is awfully hard to buck the system when you are 100% reliant and beholden to someone which he is. His only option was to do as mom directed.. that's not to say that her poison pills didn't have an affect on how he feels towards dad.. he may well be angry at him.. and not want to know him.. but it is not necessarily a forever thing.. and when he becomes more of an adult.. I would still be reaching out as a father to my son.. even if it's just unanswered cards on his birthday.
His son isn't dead.. and people who have actually lost a child. might strike a nerve.. He could say he is mourning the relationship.. the connection.. the time lost that can not be recovered.. I would stop short of saying it's death.
Right? I get it but the kid is 18
Nothing is final. My own son unexpectedly went to live with his dad one summer. It was impulsive and random. He was 16. I truly did not see that coming, yet I had to detach and let it happen, it wasn't about him and I, it was about his dad. I kept going over in my mind all the things we didn't do, all the things I wanted to share. I kept telling myself "but I'm not done raising him" well five months later he was back home and then five years later my thoughts were "is this kid ever going to launch?"
One thing I have recognized and share with my friends as their children grow an turn 18 (the magical year they are supposed to adult) is, when kids turn 18 it's tough, many aren't mature enough for the adultness it brings and parents lose a significant amount of power in the relationship. It's hard enough when this happens and there is a good relationship. Parents need to help shift the parent child relationship to accepting, your child is now a young adult, and ultimately they will be making decisions about their life and future from here on out. Many parents (myself included) need to grieve the loss of that relationship they've had for 18 years, and begin a new one. Maybe that perspective will help your DH as well.
There could be hope, but it's
There could be hope, but it's unlikely.
I actually think that is not
I actually think that is not as unlikely as you might think. he is 18.. but still very much a child who is believing his mom's narrative. I thinkyour DH should still be sending the cards.. to keep that door open.
In the end.. yes.. his son has behaved poorly.. but a LOT of that was driven by the story he believed that his mom told him to.
I agree. Look at Tog's SS. He
I agree. Look at Tog's SS. He is still very young... so there is hope. Does SS talk to your kids at all? Do they know his email address? I suggest maybe DH sending an email to him about his feelings ( I agree with everyone and not saying anything about being dead to him ) and let that be what it is..
No, he has blocked him on
No, he has blocked him on everything for the last 2 years.
There is always hope
When SS gets away from BM. Reading to the court how hurt he is isn't going to do anything. Court will say, if he didn't divorce this would not of happened. If he married the right person this would not of happen. He screw up his life and wants the court to fix everything the way he wants it to be. I know life is unfair. We all want some one to fix everything.
I was in the somewhat same thing. My DW married a loser, someone who didn't want to pay support didn't want to see his kids. Actually could not show up in court with out a few drinks. How do you ask for visitation when drunk. ? Because of her mistakes it fell onto me. This because I love you, doesn't mean I love your kids. Common topics here.
It's hard to love someone else's kids, not like a bio parent does.
Actually reading your post
Actually reading your post made me think of another reason why he should not be basically telling the court.. "my son is dead to me". In his son's current mind set.. the kid is going to get the validation that his father is disowning him.. which is not the truth.. but that is what he is likely to take from such a statement.
I'm also not sure how well the court/judge will take being blamed for all the ills and it could backfire. I think there is a lot of hindsight here.. there are a ton of would have could have should haves.. Certainly the lawyer that they used has been poor at best. Her DH probably didn't fight hard enough.. early enough for any difference to be made when it could have been made.. now it's just a long drawn out transactional accounting.. that has zero to do with the quality or lack of relationship. The court at this point doesn't care about that.. the kid is well old enough to theoretically push back on visitation. so its' just holding OP's husband accountable financially for what they think is the right amount.. which they knew was "something".. but due to their lawyer being an idiot.. lazy.. and BM being underhanded.. is probably going to be more than it should be. and.. again.. hindsight.. would have had this settled years ago on the financial end.. and it would have been cheaper.
He wouldn't tell the court
He wouldn't tell the court his son is dead to him, just that the court has caused irreparable damage.
I don’t think court is the
I don’t think court is the correct platform to do something like this, they are there to hear a case based on facts and make a determination. All the feelings and emotions mean nothing to them and only serve to waste time on an already full docket. Perhaps writing down all those thoughts and emotions and saving them someplace to be provided to SS at a later date should they begin to ever mend the relationship.
We are only there for
We are only there for finances at this point. Nothing to do with custody. It's math. I mean we are also showing BM in contempt 3 more times and perjury.
I think writing feelings down
I think writing feelings down is a good idea. It can be therapeutic. I know people who have been to rehab where they have written letters. But, they didn't send them. I actually wrote a letter to an ex boyfriend once. I wrote it. Rewrote it several times. And then deleted it. I found it therapeutic. I recommend writing the letter. Then tearing it into small pieces or burning it.
I think that DH reading
I think that DH reading anything in court would further embolden BM in her stance. I'm sure that she LOVES that she has destroyed your DH. Don't give her the satisfaction.
If your DH feels so inclined, have him write a statement/letter to the judge that can be mailed to the judge or the clerk's office. That might be able to give him some closure in this terrible situation without satisfying BM.
That's a good idea
That's a good idea
You have to be careful with
You have to be careful with this. You are not supposed to have any direct contact with the judge that isn't shared with the other side. Our BM did this twice and the judge threatened her with contempt if it happened again. I know this case is all about financials now, but I have followed your story and the judges don't seem particularly inclined to care about your DH's feelings. Also, it would be part of the court record so BM would still be able to get a copy.
Yeah
You could do it AFTER the case is closed but I fear it would fall on deaf ears.
And this will be the final
And this will be the final case. He is 18 and graduated. This is just settling financials.
He won't care
A judge's job is to give his opinion (within the confines of the law). It takes a certain amount of personal arrogance to do that. And they have to maintain some amount of healthy arrogance to continue to do that. They know they don't get it right all the time. But if every time someone thought they got it wrong they wrote a letter the judge would either ignore it, say oh well I got 99 right, or believe that you don't understand and that you're too close to it to see that what he did was really right.
That doesn't mean you're wrong. It means it's very unlikely that the judge will or should believe that he's wrong. Write it and burn it. I wanted to do the same thing to a therapist years ago who absolutely KNEW (and admitted it verbally but wouldn't write it down) that allowing BM to continue on a path she was travelling was horrible for SK. Years later it proved too much for SK and s/he left BM to come live permanently with DH. But damage was done and may never be fully erased. Telling off the therapist would do no good. She did what she did, and she would likely do it again.
For what it's worth I had an estranged child for a while. Got in a bad situation and cut off friends, family, every support person that had ever been there. Until one day a crack appeared, we were there and they reached out. Within months the relationship started solidifying and now they see what we all saw. Child was in their early 20's at the time. I truly hope that your SS gets out from under BMs influence (in school maybe, or in marriage), reaches out to the two of you and over time he gets his son back. It doesn't always happen, but it does happen. Teenagers are turds. Young 20's aren't much better. But eventually he may see DH for the dad he tried to be.
What do you call a failed attorney?
Your honor.
I can relate
I can relate. I am so sorry for your loss. I feel the same way about my mother, who I have not spoken to in 15 years. I had to think of her as dead because she was not willing to change her hurtful behavior towards me. I couldn't change her so I had to write her off. Some people don't live well with uncertainty - and your DH may be one of those people. This is likely his best way of coping.
My mother recently was diagnosed with dementia. She doesn't remember much, and forgets it within an hour. My sister told me she still thinks I am not speaking to her because I owe her money. ( I paid that debt when I was 32, so she obviously doesn't remember the real reason I don't speak to her. It would be pointless to try to reconcile, because she would go back to her prior memory of me within an hour. My DH said I should write her a nice letter, telling her I love her. This way she can re-read it when she wants, and feel better. I might do that. I have forgiven her and I don't want her to suffer any more.
Anyways. I just wanted to say that maybe this is how DH needs to process his loss. It might be less painful for him. I wish you both the best. I hope he can one day reconcile with his son.
Yes.
Both my parents are shunning me for religious reasons as is my only younger sister who is shunning me for god knows what... but they are toxic anyway and only see things in technitunnel.
PAS is a Terrible Act of Child Abuse
And is almost always permanent even into adulthood. Chef has at times stated that his 3 kids (and what was once his closest relationship, his only full blood older brother Including most of his half siblings) are dead to him as they almost all took the Girhippo's side in the divorce.
My DH just spent the weekend with his daughter who once told
My DH just spent the weekend with his daughter who once told him she wished he would die so she could dance on his grave. They had no contact for several years and she finally came back around. His situation was similar to Tog's. I don't have anything to do with her, and he realizes things could again change, but for now they are back to having a relationship. I would tell your DH it is ok to mourn, but don't lose all hope.
As far as the letter to the court - write it but don't read it in court or send it. The court doesn't care and there are too many ways it could backfire.
SS never asked and DW would have never allowed him to live with
the Spermidiot or SpermClan. Visitation was it.
He only asked once to extend summer visitation. That was the summer he turned 18yo. DW agreed to allow him to stay in Spermland for his 18th B-day. To minimize the risk he would choose to stay in SpermLand after reaching the age of majority, DW made sure to be in SpermLand for the agreed pick up date to make it far more difficult for SS to tell his mom he was not coming home.
He did not tell her that. I flew out a couple days after DW picked up SS and we had a family vacaton road trip across the country returning home. A few days into that trip, SS told us he knew that his mom had come to get him so he would have to tell her to her face that he was staying. He also told us that he knows who is family is and were his home is and that he was never intended on staying in SpermLand.
Since your SS is now 18, thought the dynamic has changed, there is no need to tolerate crap from him or from the opposition. I would also be okay with sending the Judge the letter. After all, there are no more hearings to deal with... unless you are in NY where DH is on the hook for 3 more years of CS. In that case, wait until SS is 21 to send the court the letter.
I think in the end.. if he
I think in the end.. if he wants to write something to be cathartic.. for himself.. that's fine. I know the Judge was potentially the "last line of hope" he had to force a connection with his son, but ultimately, it was not the Judge's fault that BM waged this war on his relationship with his son.. in hindsight.. even your DH made some missteps when it came to setting the stage for it to be as successful as it was. Your DH's career also fed into the incredible difficulties he experienced.. along with a legal system that is weighted towards mothers.. and his own pee poor lawyer.
So.. yes.. the Judge and court system missed opportunities to try to hold BM accountable (not the word TRY). But given the logistics of custody.. the boy's age.. their ability to do much really was muted.. I mean.. when you violate a CO.. what will the court really do? give you a stern talking to? order make up time maybe? in extreme cases.. put you in jail for contempt? (has anyone on here actually ever seen this happen???). They want people to be adults.. get along.. fulfill their legal obligations.. and not involve the court in stuff unnecessarily. When people don't behave? they may or may not really be able to make any difference.
So.. again.. court is where this ended up. I would hazard a guess your lawyer's bungling of this coupled with the distance of your DH.. and him being the "man".. combined to put him at the most disadvantage.. the court tried to rule on what they thought they had to in front of them.. BM obv had a lawyer able to spin the best story... knew how the system worked best.
In the end... you are down to financial wranglings.. that honestly is a whole bunch your own lawyer's fault.. it isn't the judge's job to research stuff.. they make decisions based on evidence in front of them.. without opposing actual evidence from your lawyer for her earnings.. etc.. the judge wasn't buying your side of that equation... your lawyer should have had it all presented in a neat package.. and even now is hoping for a last minute surprise request for documents to be available in time for the hearing.. good luck with THAT.
so.. I think writing the judge will be a mistake.. you never know if you might have to be in front of the same guy again.. this may not be over.. it is tempting to want to make a statement... but I would refrain.
My DH has/is going through
My DH has/is going through the same mourning process, he's further along now though. But it's hard to mourn a still living person who is choosing to not be involved with him. While I have a bit of hope, it's only like 1% that she'll come around when she's older. She's 19.5 now, done with her first year of college and is back at BMs for the summer. Not a word to DH. She's always been a vindictive, mean spirited person even when young. I don't see her changing, esp. because of what I know about her now (and DH chooses to not look because it will hurt him) and what my SIL knows (SIL dislikes her shockingly poor behavior as well and doesn't hold much hope either).
DH's counselor has helped him navigate the process and come to some kind of terms with it. Although, because she's alive, those milestones still hurt.
I think he should write the letter but keep it on file, not send it. DH keeps a journal and that's helped him a lot too.
My perspective is that of a
My perspective is that of a SM who's watched her DH suffer through the death of one child and estrangement from the other two.
I think OP's DH is coping as best as he can. The legal part of his situation has drug out far beyond the custody part, and the poor man had to find a way to keep going. His coping strategy may seem harsh, but it makes it possible for him to get out of bed and function each day during this period of limbo. To me, it's similar to people who, after losing a love one, chose to believe that person is "away", out in the world somewhere rather than face the awful truth.
JMTB's DH likely won't feel this way forever. He's just doing what helps him survive for now.