Not sure if it's over, but am trying one last thing.
Ok, so here goes.
Please read my last two blogs for the latest updates on what has been happening and my reason for doing this.
What I am about to do - I really need your help ST community.
I just cannot seem to get through to OH, I am out of words, at a loss and just hurt and saddened beyond anything I imagined I could ever be feeling with this man.
So I will put it all out there, the good the bad and the ugly so to speak,
And please what I would really like are honest helpful responses, I plan on showing this to OH to (hopefully) help him to see what is wrong here.
Here goes.
Ok. OH and I were teenagers when we met, I was 17 and he was 19 - we were each others first serious relationship, and he was always special in my heart. We lost touch when I was 21 and travelled overseas. Came back and got on with life.
Met up with OH again through another friend and the wonders of the internet. We were both in the process of ending bad marriages. And the inevitable happened, over the months we fell in love.
After about 7 months of phone calls and online communication he came to visit me (lived in another state) and it was amazing. HE was amazing, WE were amazing. We just worked. It was the most loved and special I had ever felt in my life, and he claimed to feel the same. We were crazy mad in love with each other.
We planned a life together, because surely we were meant to be right? (LMAO now aren't I) We spent the next 9 months or so visiting each other once a month, phone calls, internet etc. We couldn't get enough of each other, hours long phone calls every night, texting and calling all day. We worked out where we wanted to live (his state) and made our plans. It was going to be wonderful, to be together all the time, hold each other every night. And what a gift to give our children - who up to that point had only seem dysfunctional marriages - to be able to show them how it SHOULD be between a couple who love and respect each other. A model for how their relationships should look.
(cont in comments)
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So, last January (2012) I
So, last January (2012) I made the big move. Packed up my stuff, sold my house and we moved to his state (my younger 3 dd's and I) We rented a house and Oh MY BM was not a happy camper, she made problems for us.
But that's ok. We're a team right? No drama. Only his kids (ss now 9 and sd now 12) were not so happy with things. They knew BM was unhappy with me and obviously felt torn, so there were the usual teething issues. At first mainly with ss9. He was very disrespectful to me, and him and my dd (now) 10 didn't get along. I expected we would have "house rules" for all the kids to live by - he didn't agree.
My kids have always had rules and expectations. They sit at the table to eat, they don't get up and wander around with their dinner in their hands, they use cutlery. They eat what they are served unless it's something I know one particularly hates but everyone else likes in which case that child gets a pass that night. They are expected to clean up their own rooms (ok - they are kids - they complain about the food, they don't clean up their mess just like any other kids) but they point is they KNOW they are responsible.
Last year there were a lot of niggling little issues, that really got blown out of proportion, I am overly emotional and OH never noticed things or corrected behaviour - leading to blow ups which could easily have been avoided. I admit I absolutely didn't handle some of these situations well. But - an example - SS was very rude to me, constantly. He went out of his way to come between OH and I - to the point where we were laying on our bed catching up one afternoon and ss came and lay himself down BETWEEN us. I was like OMG????? and OH did nothing. I left the room. At mealtimes ss would chatter away non-stop not allowing anyone else the chance to speak, and every comment was "DAAAADDDDd - you remember when blah happened," "DAaaaaddddd more of the same." Through the whole meal.
And NOTHING was said to the child.
I attempted to discuss this with OH and he said he wasn't going to stifle his childs personality by asking him to be more respectful at the dinner table. WTF?
We were all on our way out (his 2, OH and myself, my dd's were with their dad) and ss said "Is SHE coming?" "yes" was the response. Then "In OUR car??? Why can't she take her own car?"
And NOTHING was said to the child.
One major fight - I actually left overnight and he promised change. All 4 kids (my younger 2 - dd10 and dd7, sd12 and ss9) were all in our lounge room, I was in the kitchen - lounge is through a big opening, close enough that I could see and hear, but not that they were aware of me IYKWIM. OH was outside.
DD10 and SS9 start getting into it. dd said some things, ss said some things. I said to both "that's enough" And dd stopped. SS however carried on, and got nasty. I told him "SS we have discussed that we aren't going to behave like that anymore right? And I have already asked you to stop."
That was IT. ALL I said.
SS went sobbing off to his room in hysterics.
I went out and told OH exactly what had happened, and you guessed it - he got angry at ME?? I explained that all I had done was ask ss to stop making mean comments to dd. He wanted to know EXACTLY what comments were made. I said "along the lines of blah" but I didn't remember the exact wording etc. He leapt on that. How dare I tell his kid off when I didn't even know what he had said etc, I said I did hear it, I had told them both already etc. but ss didn't stop so I only reminded him of the rules re this, that was it. I didn't think I needed minutes of the meeting!
Yelling and screaming, then he went and got sd12 to talk to her, and ask her to tell him exactly what had happened as ss and I couldn't give him the details!
I was gobsmacked. Seriously, I think that was one of the few times I used the f word in front of all the kids. Tried to make him see that he had just elevated her to being the other adult in the relationship while putting ss and I on equal CHILD footing. He couldn't see it. Still can't.
After every fight he promises he gets it. Promises things will change. But they just don't seem to.
On and on this went - the fighting, the crap. SD also had some little things happening, again, the only time something was said was when he caught her directly making trouble.
We fought a LOT. I got a bit crazy. Emotionally drained, a mess, on meds, anxiety, heart issues. The stress of never being listened to, of never being respected, of always being treated like their feelings mattered more.
Eventually came the day when I was in the car when he dropped them back to BM,s. She was waiting out the front (odd as she apparently NEVER comes out of the house) Funny how SD had been on the phone to her about 20 minutes earlier... anyway. BM went beserk at me, opened the car door and started screaming at me (all 4 kids in the car, OH getting skids bags out of the boot) I tried to close the door but she held on to it. I asked her to please let go of the door as she was scaring the children. More screaming and abuse but she let the door go.
OH took the bags up to the door, SS was in tears, BM then went on to scream at OH. SS standing between them. SD just walks through the middle and into the house. Oh tells me later that she was screaming that ss tells her all about how much I abuse them, how mean I am and how I always tell him off and yell at him, how OH and I favour my kids and they get treated better etc etc etc. OH pointed out to SS that none of it was true, ss insisted it all was. He also stood up for me to BM and told her to butt out and that it was none of her business, etc.
When OH saw SS again he talked to him about it all and how it was not ok for ss to lie about me like that etc.
Things with ss have been SO much better since then. We still have the odd moment but he's a pretty good kid now, and the one time I have had to say something to him (just a gentle reminder of the rules) he knew and was fine with it.
SD on the other hand.
Hmmm well, I guess things must have improved and been quiet for a while - oh my father passed away last November after a very short battle with cancer. I had told OH I didn't want any of the kids on our bed or in our bed (after very early on SD crowed to me about how she loved it when I went out early on a Saturday with my dd's because she jumps into my spot in the bed with daddy) I explained to OH that I was not comfortable with any of the kids in our bed, it was OUR place, where we were intimate with each other etc. He didn't like it, his response was "we have always done this" I said "ok, but I am not BM, I am NOT ok with it, and you need to respect that I do not want it happening." Thought that was the end of that. The day my father passed away dd's and I flew interstate (to my family) hoping against hope to get there before he went - we didn't make it - an hour late) I was pretty devastated.
I spoke to DD20 who was still at home (she couldn't get the whole week off work) and she mentioned (innocently) that OH and the skids were all snuggled up in my bed. I just could not believe it. And the timing. Wow. Words were had - again.
But apart from that I think the last 5 or so months of last year were improving. Then we found the perfect house, so we bought it. It is great, suits us down to the ground (needs some TLC but don't we all) We moved in January. And the shit started with SD. She sends my dd10 nasty notes on their ipods (Fuck you, Fuck off) etc. She had a handwritten note saying "I hate dd10", has stolen items from dd10 - things have been found in her room, I just put them back in dd's room for the most part. There were some very nasty comments made by sd to dd and also one to OH about me. I discussed this with OH, how inappropriate it was, and that he needed to tell her it was NOT ok - he should have done it the second she bad mouthed me to him, but her saying things to MY kid? so not on. He never dealt with it.
Imagine how that felt to me?
A month or so back we were all at the beach, Oh was rounding up the other kids, and SD came up to where I was packing the rest of the stuff and waiting for everyone. She said she wanted to go and have a shower, and started walking off towards them. I told her to wait, that we were all going over there as soon as OH and the others came back, so we would all go together. She went anyway. So OH starts coming back to me with the other kids, then sees her at the shower, and has to go over there and wait with her. So I am now trying to carry everyone's shit, while we are all waiting on SD. I was pissed, and when he came over I told him what had happened, I expected him to talk to her. But no. It wasn't dealt with.
Since all this he has admitted that he should have discussed the issues with her, but it's too late now.
A few weeks back I got home and they were all here so he and I went into our bedroom to talk about something, and while we're in there he gets first a text from BM (get my kids out of there immediately) and then a phone call? WTF again!! SD had called her to say we were fighting in the bedroom - funnily enough what we were discussing was SD and how I don't trust her in my study as she reports back to BM and I am not comfortable with it..... He actually still couldn't admit she was in the wrong.
Apparently because my dd told me what sd had said about me sd is entitled to discuss our business with HER mother too?
There has just been so many issues, so many little white lies and ommissions. I asked a few weeks ago for total transparency, absolute honest as I am starting to not trust my OH. I love this man to death, I want to grow old with him, he is the only person I have ever known that I have felt this strongly about, and I am starting to not trust him. It's all crumbling around us, and I need that rebuilt.
So - read the last blog for the latest incident.
What can I do? I can't do THIS anymore that's for sure. I've read books, we've seen counsellors, I've seen counsellors, I've blogged, I've talked I've asked for what I need.
Nothing changes.
So, ST community, how do I make OH understand that WE need to be the couple, the adults, the priorities? That he has to stop putting his children above me? That he needs to be honest with me? Am I really asking for too much?
I know I have made mistakes. I know I get angry and upset, I get so frustrated because I always listen and try to see his perspective, I think then it should work the other way - he should try to understand mine, and then we need to try to find the middle ground so that everyone's needs are met? Only that never happens.
He doesn't listen to me, and I lose it.
Ok, I read this blog and your
Ok, I read this blog and your last one (about your H keeping secrets from you/lieing by ommission)
I am going to be honest with you here, because that's what you said you wanted and because I have been in your shoes to some extent with my DH. I will preface by saying, I am not picking on you, judging you or trying to be a turd stirrer, I am telling what I see as an outsider.
I think you have pushed your H into a corner so to speak and he feels forced to leave information out in order to keep the peace with you. I think you are the one in the relationship who wants to have the control i.e. if you say you don't want skids in your bed, then that's the way it should be, if skids should be home by 9 pm, then your H best be on the road with them by 8:59. I am very much like you, I tend to get caught up in the details of things and I am a bit of a micromanager. But I have really tried to tone that down over the years, because my DH is the exact opposite and I need to respect that. My DH doesn't sweat the small things, so in order for us to work, we need to meet in the middle.
It seems to me that some of the things that you have put great focus on and that upset you greatly are small things in the scheme of the bigger picture. So what, if you're not home and skids are hanging out in your bed with their dad? Don't get me wrong, I HATED it when skids would lounge around on MY bed chatting or watching TV with DH BUT, I crab to myself, not DH. Does it bug me? Yes. Is it worth a big fight with DH, where I come out looking like a petty jerk? No. I don't agree with the fact that your H lied to you about taking the skids for dinner, BUT I also see why he did. He was trying to avoid a shit storm. I have found that most men are chronic shitstorm avoiders.
SS rambling on at the dinner table? Again, yes annoying, BUT not worth a battle in my book. I guess what I am trying to say is that you shoulder some of the blame here in the way your H is behaving. He keeps things from you to avoid a shitstorm, he is putting his kids ahead of you because you have pushed him to feel the need to "protect" them.
I'm not trying to say your H is a saint and has no blame here, absolutely not...it's not cool to keep things from your wife, it's not cool to make your wife feel inferior to your kids, it's not cool to make arrangements with BM/skids and then TELL you later how things are going to be.
Again, I'm just saying how what you have posted looks to me... someone who is looking in from the outside. If I've offended you I apologize and feel free to delete my reply. Best of luck to you, I hope you can find some peace and work things out.
Hi, thanks to you both for
Hi, thanks to you both for your responses,
I understand what you are both saying.
Daizy Duke, Yes, small issues, I said that at the start, but also respect issues. There are a lot of things I have let slide, I don't discipline unless it's one of the few areas we have discussed, my kids have my rules and his have - well none. And that's fine, not my kid not my problem, unless it affects me or my kids.
I didn't have a problem so much with him taking them to the restaurant, though his timing sucked, but the issue was that he LIED about it? Why lie? Why not just say the kids were upset, so we stopped and got a sundae and had a chat. That's all that needed to be said you know?
The being home at 9pm? HE promised me that, not ME demanding it. He knew that it was a big ask giving up yet another free Saturday night, our only night for couple time. So he promised me faithfully that he would be dropping them off at 9, then it changed once I had agreed, hope that makes more sense about why I was annoyed.
I haven't actually asked him to change or do a whole lot for me, probably the bed issue was the one thing - I really do NOT want them in our bed. It's a biggy you know? Don't sweat the small stuff, but when it really matters then yeah I expect to be respected on those.
I guess I mention all the little petty things only to explain how things have been, I did expect that we would set rules for all the kids - some of his and some of mine. He refused so my kids are living by my rules whilst his have none. and that's not really great for my kids. And when it's outright rudeness or disrespect (which is what was happening at the dinner table that night - as soon as anyone else attempted to open their mouth ss bulldozed straight over them with another "DAAAADDDDD remember when we blah, we should all go back and blah again, you me and mum" So yeah, I did actually (and still do) think that OH should have asked him to be more respectful of the other 5 people at the table and not talk over them.) It wasn't just "rambling on" it was an outright attempt to exclude everyone else at the table and have it just be him and OH.
Another of the lies? Again it was on our "couple time" weekend, and I was very sick. I mean seriously the Dr wanted me in hospital sick, but I promised him I would rest up that weekend, and OH would take care of me. Late Friday OH calls me to say that SS had phoned him and wanted to spend the night at ours, usually it's a yes, but that time I said no. I begged, I pleaded, I explained what the Dr had said, and none of it mattered, OH wanted to do what he wanted to do so that's what happened. Only he told me it was just the Friday night? Turned out it was the whole weekend, he thought he'd lie to me and get the kid there, and then admit the truth on Saturday....
It's not about control, it's about respect, give and take etc.
I get that he lies to avoid facing difficult things, but the thing is, if he had told the truth a lot of the time I would have been oh ok, whatever. you know?
I agree that you have to pick
I agree that you have to pick your battles. I have this same problem. I have to tune out the skids at dinner because their manners and incessant babbling drive me nuts. But I have to let that go. I will not let go of the fact that I need my personal space and Skids are not allowed in my room. That was a long battle but now FDH at least gets it and reinforces it. And if your guy doesn't get it, I would recommend you start leaving private items out in the open in your room. It's your room and you don't have to keep it rated G for his kids. He might get the pciture then.
THANK YOU. You got it - the
THANK YOU.
You got it - the point I was making, and I do feel that the bed IS a big deal - as you say it's our one safe haven in a house with 5 kids (and two cats - but I do let them on the bed LOL)
And for him to do it THEN was what made it so much harder, yes, to anyone else and at any other time probably no big deal, but to disrespect my wishes so blatantly THEN? THAT was hard.
And yes, it's just been so hard and so long and so painful - and always about them, so no, sometimes I will be driving and that's when I feel the loss IYKWIM? But in general no, there isn't a lot of space, time, consideration.
And yes, if I felt the little efforts then it would get easier - I would feel like an important part of his life and not an outsider he hangs with when the "important people" are unavailable.
We discussed this all very late Friday night (he didn't come home Thursday, and not til after midnight Friday and only then because he had the skids and nowhere else to take them) I *think* he got it, finally.
Here's hoping.
Shaking, I have been reading your story as well, and haven't commented as I have no wisdom to offer, only hugs and hope for a better future for you all.