Depends on their dynamic.

Do they generally otherwise get along well?

If the NCP is saying no just to cause grief to the CP, it doesn't necessarily make them a bad parent, but it sure paints them in a terrible light, as an idividual.

That kind of thing would be discussed in an intact family with combined income anyway, wouldn't it? if one parent doesn't want to spend the money but the other does, the one who wants to spend takes it out of their own disposable income. That's how it worked in my marriage, anyway... nowadays, since I make a decent amount more than ex-dh, I tend to pay for more extra-curriculars than he does, but he pitches in when he can, even if 'pitching in' means doing all the driving to take them/pick them up to their activities, or paying 10$ on the 100..

It depends what it's for. If CP arbitrary decides kids should havs expensive XYZ that isnt needed then NCP doesn't have to bend backwards. It has to be within reason.

Do you think that a NCP should pay for something besides CS and the stipulations of a CO?

usually no.

Say for instance the CP asks the NCP for pay for something extra because they say they cannot afford it? If the NCP doesn't do it or want to do it do you think that makes them a bad parent?

no. No more than it makes the CP a "bad parent" for not being able to afford it.

No

Based on the ridiculous child support awards over the past 10 years or so, NO.

Now if a parent is skirting the system (we know many do) being under employed or not employed at all to avoid true calculations---then yes, ask away. I hope they step up for the kids sake.

BUT if you unilaterally sign a child up for anything, you pay for it then.

Think it depends on what the "something extra" is and the circumstances behind that "something extra" and "not being able to afford it"

Like when BM2 used to call up DH the week before school saying she needed help buying SS school clothes because she was broke. Yet she just went on a trip to California. And it's not like the first day of school is some surprise event. You KNOW that you kid is going to need school clothes, so you set that money aside, pick up bargains over the summer etc. You don't flit off to California and then expect dad to buck up money at the last minute.

Now let's say hypothetically here (because the only "instrument" my SS plays in real life is the marijuana bong)that BM2 contacted DH because SS wanted to play the trombone in the school band, but she didn't have enough money to pay for it. Then I could see DH helping out. It was something that wasn't known ahead of time, and it's something constructive and educational that SS could do.

We do it all the time. Just got an ask for $99 by Friday for a deposit for a school trip.

Really don't mind most of the time...always hate the last-minute, urgent nature of the requests.

It depends. I mean, both parents should pay for the basic necessities like someone else mentioned. But above that, I think it should be dependent on what you can afford. I really think both parents should want the child to be happy first and foremost, which doesn't mean spoiling the child of course, but for example...

Let's say the child wants a $100 backpack for school. CP can't afford it but NCP can - it's just not the best use of their money. NCP says no. That makes sense. It's a silly purchase.

But change the purchase a bit... Let's say the child wants dance lessons for $100 a month. They have wanted to be in dance lessons for years. They've never gotten to do something like this before. CP can't afford it but NCP can - and comfortably without worrying. They should pay for the dance lessons because it's in the best interest of their child - will make them happy, keep them physically fit, help them learn dedication/build character, etc.

Hope that makes sense. I just think parents who love their kids will put what they can afford towards them and bettering their lifestyle/future.

The answer of course will depend upon the circumstances. Is it a need or a want? Is it something you would consider usual and customary or is it an extraordinary thing? What is the relative financial position of the parents?

My DH and I did buy things for his girls outside the CO and provided money for school trips and vacations with friends etc..

Did he give BM money when she asked if he would give her money so that she could give the girls a "nice Christmas"? NO he did not.

I think that it is nice if a NCP is willing to share in extra things that the kids do, but if it is absolutely not possible.. well poor kids don't get everything they want either.

If the NCP has any custody time whatsoever, s/he is paying more than CS/CO'd stuff. But the NCP has decision-making power about that, which is where, for me, the big difference lies.

If I were an NCP, and my ex wanted me to pay for xyz, even if things were peaceful, I most likely would not.

If I were an NCP, and things were peaceful with my ex, and my kid wanted to participate in some activity or another, I would consider paying for it IF it was 100% on my time. I *might* also consider paying if my ex contacted me to ask if my kid had mentioned xyz activity to me, or anything else my kid had also expressed an interest in.... and then we decided together which options we'd get more information about, and then after doing so my kid was still interested in xyz activity AND it fit into my budget/schedule AND my ex was clearly supportive of both the schedule and my additional contribution.

NCP or CP, my role is as my kid's parent, not as my ex's banker. I already fund my ex's decisions as a parent with CS, no way will I give a single dime of contact or control to my ex beyond that. Because that relationship is over.

I would do what I thought was best for my kid, as long it was in the realm of my possibilities. I've had to learn to make do with what I have, and honestly, it's a lesson in gratitude, contentment, and creativity. Why wouldn't I want that for my kid?

The problem is that some CP use this as a form of PAS. Tell the child 'ask your father' for x, y or Z then when dad says no, he is the bad guy. Creates disney dads etc.

On the whole I'm against it but of course it all depends on the dynamics of the exes relationships and if there is no PAS then I think it could be a reasonable thing if the ncp can afford it and wants to do it.

NO it doesn't make them a bad parent.

In our case, I make double what DH makes in salary and 4 x what BM makes. I could provide for my BS without support and was able to give him nice things which he appreciated.

DH pays BM support like clockwork. However, anytime I purchased my BS a pair of tennis shoes, BM expected that OSS and MSS should get the same. The difference is, I can afford to buy my BS top of the line shoes and BM cannot. Yet she would go out and buy them, and them hit DH up for 1/2 the costs. She would also sign MSS up for expensive travel leagues (Thousands of dollars a season) and expect DH to cover half. All without consulting him in any way.

None of this is covered in the CO and I don't feel DH is a bad parent if he actually stood up to BM and told her NO!

I told DH many times that BM needs to learn to live within her means and stop expecting him to compensate for her lack of income. Especially considering DH doesn't make much after CS anyway.

I don't think saying no makes them a bad parent. If the cp does not like the terms of the parenting plan and child support agreement then they can try to get that modified (either through negotiation with the ncp or with help from the courts and a judge). At some point most parenting plans and cs agreements will need to be modified as the needs of the child and the circumstances of the adults change over the years.

Having said that, the ncp should be paying for the things in their own home for the kid(s) such as clothes/toys etc. and some of those may end up at the other parent's house.

If the ncp chooses to contribute beyond what has been legally agreed upon that is their choice and decision. In the case of one off expenses or things not covered in the parenting plan and they want to contribute to a car or a cell plan or a school trip then that is their choice. Most parents would help towards those things if they are able and if they feel the child will benefit from them. If they are constantly being hit up for extra's though they may begin to feel resentful.

What used to really bug me was the $5 here and $20 there that was absolutely necessary for bm to have straightaway that she couldn't wait until she next got cs (twice a month on the 1st and in the 15th without fail). She apparently had no one else to borrow $5 from or $5 to her name with a week to go until she next got some cs. I have so many tales of ridiculous things she asked money for, just waiting for the next.

I do not think NCP should pay extra above CS if the CP wastes the CS on wasteful purchases and refuses to work. For example: CP buying a larger TV when cp already has one; CP buying new clothing or getting CP hair done at salon when CP could wear existing clothing and trim own hair; Treating SKIds to take out every meal instead of buying groceries and planning meals; and then asking NCP to pay for ice-skates and hockey school. Your poor planning does not equal my problem.

I have my son about 80% and do not get a lot of cs and pay the health insurance. Ex is supposed to Pay 40% of medical but it just isn't worth it to go after it. I can't imagine asking him to pay for anything else.

For baseball I spent about 500.00 this year for fees and equipment. I plan on signing him up for a clinic this winter and for a very special one in June that he is working to earn as it is 400.00. He is a good kid who gets excellent grades and this is his passion and I will support it.

I am thankful I have a good job and can do these thing.

I don't agree with the thought that because I have the majority of the parenting responsibilities I have to pay for everything too. His dad is not capable of doing the hard stuff, the important stuff that goes into raising a mentally healthy, responsible young man.

Some CPs expect NCPs to fully support their children. I understand since they don't live with kids they need to contribute child support but I don't believe they should be sole providers while CP is either not working or being underachieving and underemployed and keep demanding things from NCP, usually men. I think nowadays women have many opportunities of getting education and decent employment and not cry poor all the time.

I was CP and my ex paid CS and did a lot as a good father should but I didn't sit on my butt and demanded more and more either.

If the NCP pays above and beyond what is ordered, if something happens to NCP financially, then the CP usually expects them to maintain that level of support from what I've read. The Court would probably see that the NCP is able to consistently pay more than what is ordered and will probably stick them with the extra they are paying. Kind of what happened with Gunner and his 1st ex-wife.

If the CP wants more $ for things, it's smart on the NCP's part to have them put it before a judge to ensure that it is fair and that they don't get kicked if they ever hit hard times. If the NCP does extras with kids on their time it's not CP's business what they're paying IMHO.

This is a difficult one. My experience was that I never went to court for support until my youngest went to high school. I just simply could no longer afford to do it on my own. We divorce when she was in 4th grade. He gave not a dime for anything. When we went to court the support that I got didn't even cover 1/2 of the school tuition let alone busing, uniforms, school supplies, etc. Then of course you have your every day clothes and shoes. I was only concerned about the education. I paid for dance classes and sports. She had been in both since age 5. The financial struggle was real. A couple of times I asked him if he could help me with some extras such as school trip, class ring, prom expenses. Each and every time I was told No...that is what the child support is for. Are you kidding me! Somehow we made it through and I have never regretted doing without so that my child had the quality education that she deserved. Oh and then there was the therapist expenses. Forgot about that. Don't know what I ever saw in him. He is going to be a lonely old man. The gal that he cheated on me with has already left him. LOL

Now on the other hand. My DH paid a lot in CS in addition to all medical, dental and prescription. His Ex lied in court. Told them she didn't bring pay stubs or taxes because she didn't have any. What she failed to say is that she was running a cash business. DH never said a work because he didn't want her to get into trouble. She had the skids calling all of the time for extra money. The day before school they needed school clothes, shoes, supplies. What was she doing with all of this money? I knew what I was doing with my little bit. She got three times what I got and didn't have tuition to pay. DH paid for class trips to Disney, class rings, proms, you name it and it was all last minute with them calling and crying the blues that Mommy doesn't have it. Now during this time Mommy was going to cruises, travelling the world, going on island vacations, going on ski trips and always was dressed with hair and nails done. I am sure you get the picture.

I agree with CS. I just wish that people would go to court and be honest and let the cards fall where they may. As far as the extra's if the support is fair and the parents were truthful. I would have liked for my Ex to have helped and contributed to the extras. I wouldn't have asked if I didn't need his help. I always asked way in advance of the due date.

In my case I did it all as far as the extras and my daughter knows it. She also knows to never ask her Father for anything as the answer will always be no. She is afraid to ask him for anything...even a ride. Because of living on a shoe string for so long my daughter is very good with her money. She is a bargain shopper and a saver, not a spender.

In my DH's case, they continue to ask for money. Seems like that will never change. They believe that they are entitled. None of them are good with money. It's easier to have the bank of Dad bail you out each and every time. It has always worked for them.

We all want our kids to have the best that we can provide. I just always taught my kids the difference between wants and needs and to save for those things that they wanted.

Does the NCP feel like a bad parent of do they simply not care? I guess it depends on the circumstance of the parents of what is being asked.