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What would you do if you knew?

groovetheory's picture

I thought this would be a good forum topic. Ok, SD8 rarely talks to her mom on the phone or grannie (on moms side) - this is because of her mom always being unavailable. However when she does talk on the phone DH always listens in - because he doesn't trust SD8 to reiterate the conversations in fears that they are talking about things that they shouldn't be. One day -- here was the conversation.

SD8: I want to live with you
BM: Are you sure, because you keep changing your mind
SD8: Yes, but I also want to live here. I wish I could live there and then live here.
BM: Well if you wanted to live here I was going to see if I can get you.
SD8: How are you going to do that with the courts and stuff
BM: Ohh, I'm not going to mess with that stuff, but I'm also not going to tell you anything because you have a big mouth. I can't trust you to keep a secret.
SD8: I will, what is it?
BM: Don't worry about it, you'll see

Fast forward. When DH asked SD8 about what they talked about, she lied about the whole conversation, which contained more than the above - so we know we can't trust her. Fast forward again, over the holidays SD8 went to go and spend time with her family. When she came back, in the car she stated...

"Ohh my mom wanted me to ask you guys if I could go to California with her over the summer".

So automatically we think that either BM is just asking us through her and not letting SD8 in on what she is planning to do -- or she is bringing SD8 in on her schemes. Basically we think she is trying to plan to take SD8 and not come back.

DH is ok to to let her go to Cali with her mom - as long as he knows where she is going to be and a phone number, and address. He thinks that BM isn't that smart to take her and just be gone. He also thinks that if she does that she is basically going to jail. I don't know what do think and am just taking his lead. I would say - don't trust BM, but she does not think things through and will eventually get caught. I mean she could give us a bogus phone number and address and call it a day.

What would you do?

Dealing_with_Drama's picture

Your DH should say, "Sure, I will just call my attorney and we will get this all set in stone." Oh and "Have a great trip." My husband has basically had to go to court everytime we wanted to take a vacation and as much as a PITA is was, it was always for the best because then Crazy's :evil: vacations would get brought up and there was NO wiggle room.

"What you do to children; they will do to society." ~Karl Menninger

SM#1's picture

I didn't think you could do that. But yes for sure, get it in writing--where, how to contact and when they will be returning. That way if she does not return you can go after her.

Never Ending's picture

Does your H have an agreement with BM..all visitation are clearly outlined in this document and if you have full custudy BM needs an approval to take her out of state..

I would say No, a BIG FAT NO..the SD cannot go to California. It seems like the BM is being sneaky and manipulative, . Why take the chance? If BM is not within her rights, let her take you to court.

Why put the little girl in the middle of this,she is only 8.. it will eventually hurt her. I would just tell SD, Im sorry but that is not possible, at this time,
Tell BM to check with you first before you start putting ideas in her head. It not the SD decision its your...

I say NO NO NO...unless everything is clearly stated in a modification agreement, Obviously the BM is playing head games.
Stop it right now before it goes any further..

Sita Tara's picture

If DH has FC at least someone may help to get SD back if BM keeps her out of state. If they have shared no one will do anything. And even with full, I remember a poster, either here or another site who's ex was released from JAIL, picked up his child for visitation like it never was interrupted in the first place, then kept him way past the time he was supposed to return him and the courts did NOTHING because he was in another state and there was tons of red tape.

If you think something is amiss and DH has FC, I would say no to an out of town trip. If they haven't established guidelines, I'd make sure to do the bare minimum. Something does not sound right. BM can take her trip and make up time in state. BD is far too young, and there is far too much secretive discussing going on between them.

I say do the minimum the agreement says to do. And get this kid to a counselor where maybe some of this can come out to an unbiased professional who can help you.

"Om Tare Tutare Ture Mama Ayurpunye Jnana Putin Kuru Svaha"
~Sita Tara Mantra

groovetheory's picture

To answer a few questions. We have full on custody with SD8 and can make full decisions regarding her well being. BM pays no child support. It wasnt' awarded to us when we made custody, but left blank so that we can pursue it at any time. DH doesn't want to pursue CP. As far as taking her anywhere...we would have to give that ok, and get it in writing. As far as visitation with her mom, it is EOW however BM never sees her regularly. She'll see her a day maybe two on certain breaks. As far as summer, we have them split per the custody documents, she gets half, and we get half. She cannot take her out of WI, unless approved by us.

Sita Tara's picture

Like some of the other posters. If you feel in your guy BM is being deceptive about a trip, and may be planning something/conspiring with an 8 yo?

It doesn't sound good. My SD's BM is paranoid, so sometimes she instructs SD she is not allowed to tell us things, but SD doesn't usually honor that. If it's big and bothers my SD she will tell me.

BM in our case (SD is older) always tells SD elaborate tales of big plans to do exciting things. Then never follows through. SD just mentioned the other day how BM is going to move to Florida and SD wants to go too. DH asked SD if she thought BM was seriously going to follow through and SD said, "NO. She's been telling me we are going to Disney for Thanksgiving for 4 years and we never have yet." SD also said BM told her after the custody case she could never live with her again because "it was a slap in the face."

So SD says she knows she won't move to Florida even if BM did. As a matter of fact I think SD knows if BM does move to Florida that SD won't see her at all. Not because we wouldn't negotiate it, but BM did away with EO weekend visits completely because she didn't want SD for three whole days at a time. Though she claimed to SD it was because her new job requires she work weekends...and weeknights...and weekdays apparently because if SD has a day off school BM is always "working" too.

So...I say let BM come and go, help the child to let go of attachment to BM following thru, and absolutely NO out of state trips when the woman can't even keep regularly scheduled visitation.

"Om Tare Tutare Ture Mama Ayurpunye Jnana Putin Kuru Svaha"
~Sita Tara Mantra

Never Ending's picture

The court/ or BM, saw it was in the best interest of the child that DH have full custody. This BM seems unreliable. and her best interest are not for her child.
BM hardly sees the SD now, and then to send SDr ono a trip..and the BM should of just asked your permission first before she started telling the child

SD does deserve to have a good relationship with her BM, but that is totally up to the BM, not you. When BM makes time for her child EOW on a steadly basis.

My suggestion is still NO..and inform BM, that she should not tell SD anything like that until BM consults with DH. Dont give the SD ideas, so that it turns around to make you look like the bad guys by saying NO...you have full custody..

If you smell something fishy..then something stinks

Good luck

groovetheory's picture

You are right, basically - she shouldn't have told SD8 anything until she talked with us, so now if we say no - we are the bad guys keeping her away from her mom. We definately want SD8 to have a healthy relationship with her mom, but not one that she never sees her except for twice a year. I'll definately bring this up to DH. BM will have to limit her visit with SD8 for the summer to the borders of our good state!