Stuck between rock and a hard place

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First time poster here - so am hoping you guys can help me out!

II live in the Middle East with my wife who is from Central Asia. We have 2 children, both under 2. I also have a son from my first marriage who is almost 10. My ex and I split over two years ago, and I met my current wife during the separation period.

Currently my big issue is the way my wife reacts to me visiting my son in Europe. She goes almost off the radar entirely and does not communicate much while I am visiting him. The issue is that my ex wife has poisoned my son against my current wife, and has made her the villain in the marriage breakdown - despite their being no factual basis. My ex has also forbidden my son from meeting my wife and cuts off any conversations I have with my son if she hears any mention of my family or if my kids in the background.

Now my current wife is not asking me to choose between her and my son. She wants to incorporate him
Into our life so she doesn't lose me for the limited fee time I actually get from work. She is deeply hurt and upset by my ex, but she is not very understanding of the fact that I have little choice if I want to maintain a relationship with my son. My wife wants me to just tell my ex/use legal means that she has no choice and my son must come with us - my concern is that is going to have opposite result and my ex will step up the venom...I was with her for almost 13 years, so I know how vengeful she can be. Also, my view is that whilst my son has a highly negative view of my wife it wouldn't be productive for them to meet - I think it would be counter productive at the moment. I am petrified of making errors that will cost me long term....

I feel that whatever I do, I can't win - I can't risk losing my boy by pushing him into our family, I know my ex will get worse if I do apply pressure to say she is being unfair, and whilst I understand my wife's position I feel she is not being fair by giving my the silent treatment when I come to see my boy. I feel trapped with a huge weight on my shoulders right now...if anyone can advise me, it would be great!
Many thanks.

Thanks Echo Yes I moved on

Thanks Echo

Yes I moved on very quickly - and that is part of the issue I believe. I ought to make it clear - my ex threatened me with divorce for years. She used my son as a mechanism for me to back down in any conflict. After many years of this tactic, I eventually turned around and said I wanted a divorce. She now uses the fact that I asked for a divorce to say that it was all me - that I left her etc... rather than accept any responsibility for her part in what happened. She is now using this to say I abandoned my son, kicked him out, made himlose his home and friends. This has obviously impacted heavily on my son. Consequently my son has needed a therapist due to this behaviour. I've asked to see the medical notes, but she again refuses..

I had mentally moved on a number of years before the divorce and I asked my ex to see a counselor before I asked for a divorce- I wanted to try and salvage something for the sake of our son. After she rejected me on a number of occasions, I knew there was only one exit from the situation if I didn't want to be bullied by my ex for the next twenty years...and getting away from my ex has saved me from a mental breakdown. I met my current wife after a few months of separation. We hit it off very quickly. I had never had such strong chemistry with anyone She was only visiting my city originally for a week, so I thought we'd just be friends. After a month, I visited her ciry on business and things developed very quickly between us. We both knew there was something very strong and that we wanted more than friendship. So we went into a long distance relationship where I'd visit once a month and she'd come to see me now and again.. After our second visit, we discovered she was pregnant. We had been using precautions somit was a shock to us both. As non married relationships are illegal in the Middle East, she stayed in her home country during the pregnancy, which was very hard on her. I visited frequently and attended all scans and regular docs visits.. We agreed not to openly discuss with my ex until divorce was finalised, so that she wouldn't try to use the situation as leverage against me. Once my divorce was finalised, I told my ex about my partner. This started off accusations of me having affairs before the split, that my new partnerwas a gold digger, that I had thrown my child out and replaced him...she also stopped me talking directly to him. She made everything go through her so she could control the narrative with my son. She would sit next to him during calls and cut me off if I tried to tell him about my new life...I get she was trying to protect him, but she made the situation worse by not allowing him to understand what happened and why.

I want my son to meet his

I want my son to meet his half siblings- but I also want to protect my wife from the situation. As my ex has stirred up my son so much, he openly says he hates my new family and never wants to see them. You are totally right that I am scared - it is a poisonous situation. I don't want the first impression of my son to be negative or aggressive. He really is the sweetest child and amazingly intelligent, but my ex has stirred him up so much that he has been to see a therapist over explosive and occasionally physically violent outbursts. As I haven't had access to the therapist ( ex hasn't made them available) or the notes, I am unsure as to whether or not this is true. I'm currently using the time I spend with my son to make him see I am not evil, that I haven't just abandoned him, and that Inlove all of my family equally. I am trying to show my wife in a positive light so that he is less anti to meeting them.

I totally get where you are coming from re pushing it by whatever means necessary- I have found a lawyer who deals with my wife's home country to see where my rights lie. I have a gut feeling that my ex is playing the medical card tomstop me pushing - but without seeing the notes, I can't ratify what my sons mental state is. I have told my ex that she must hand over the medical evidence for review or my lawyer will take the matter to a judge. Once I have the evidence and have it ratified , I am ina better position to push for them to meet. I am frightened to push my son to meet if it is going to damage him further. This is the only reason I have not pushed my son into meeting my new family.

I totally get what my wife is saying in terms of forcing my son to meet her and his half siblings- however, I have to protect my son too. My wife wants to just rip the band aid off and get the meeting on the table so it removes the stigma my son has. However, I want to get a full medical view that it is safe to do this first. Dealing with a foreign legal system in another language is not simple and not cheap - this is why I cannot go any faster currently. I've already spent thousands of Euro to get to this point...and I literally cannot afford to keep throwing this kind of cash at lawyers every month. If I get medical all clear, I believe my ex won't have a leg to stand on...maybe my tactics are wrong to do it this way....what do you think?

In the US and a great many

In the US and a great many other western countries, you would have zero chance of getting visitation in your non-Hauge convention country. You need to be careful that you are realistic with your goals so that you don't waste money. Not all attorneys are honest and given the challenges (both geographical and language) you are going to have a hard time managing this.

I am guessing that you agreed to much of this because you had gotten your current wife pregnant and were in a hurry to divorce. While it is too late for you, there is a lesson here for others.

If your EX is in a country

If your EX is in a country that has signed the Hague Convention (are you familiar with this) and you are located in a country that has not signed it, you are not likely to win a court case where the court forces your EX to allow the child to visit where you are living.

Your wife needs to understand that legal action (if I am correct) will not be fruitful.

https://www.ag.gov.au/FamiliesAndMarriage/Families/InternationalFamilyLa...

Frankly, I wouldn't allow my child to visit a non-custodial parent in the middle East. Sorry. Not ever.

You moved on very quickly and did you move away from your son or did your EX return to Europe?. Your name indicates you are an EX Pat, do you have plans to return to the country where your son resides?

In the meantime, how long are your visits with your son? If you plan to return home eventually, next time you go to Europe take your new family with you. Your ex can't control who you introduce him to.

How often do you visit? Your wife needs to grow up, this is your child after all. Silent treatment is a very immature response to a difficult situation.

Thanks for the response. We

Thanks for the response. We lived in Middle East for years before the divorce, then ex returned to Europe. The place where I live is not a signatory of Hague Convention which makes it a major problem. I also agreed to a clause in our divorce contract that I would never take him to a non HC country without written permission from her. She was always paranoid about the idea I would stop him going back. I understand her fear, but as I travel for work it is unfounded as I could never step foot on European soil with bout being arrested.

With regards to moving to country where my son lives - I have no intention of going to that country as I don't speak the language, and I wouldn't be able To financially support two families there. My ex has also made it clear that she will make my life even more challenging if I do not maintain the level of financial support that I am currently giving them.

I get a number of weekends and a two week holiday access every year. The problem is that Middle East weekends don't align with European ones. It's Friday/Saturday as opposed to Saturday/Sunday. As I only get 4 weeks holiday, this is obviously denting the amount of time I get with my current family. My wife is happy to go to any place necessary to meet. She doesn't want to lose most of the free time I have due to my ex.

It frustrating as I know my

It frustrating as I know my wife wants nothing more than a peaceful relationship with my son and I. She wants us to show that he is just as important as his siblings. Her heart is in the right place.

I call BS on this. If she

I call BS on this. If she did, she would not go silent and punish you when you visit him.

'...she is not very

'...she is not very understanding of the fact that I have little choice if I want to maintain a relationship with my son...'
I wonder that you are being too considerate of your wife here. She is not the mother of your son and although she wants to 'incorporate him' into your life that is clearly fraught with problems in your current situation. You sound like a good dad, I hope your 10 year old grows to have a relationship with you that acknowledges how difficult your situation is.
From my perspective all you owe your current wife is to be a good husband and father to your joint children and try somehow to keep things separate. It seems to me this boy has two women fighting over him and the only one who should win is bio-mum. I feel for your situation, but do what is right for this boy. He can always meet his half-siblings at some point in the future when he's a little older, it seems to me. As long as you keep him in the loop and explain things clearly to everyone it should all work out. If her heart is in the right place she needs to realise this boy's place is with his mom- and with you whenever you can visit. I think she's just thinking of herself and trying to keep you close.

Thanks Fairyo. It's very

Thanks Fairyo. It's very challenging. My wife is taking it as a personal snub, even though it is coming from my ex. I also think she sees it as my ex controlling me even though we have are not together. My son gets 3!weeks of the 4 weeks leave I have every year, and my wife just wants some more time with my family. It is a disproportionate split, but my wife and kids get to see me every day...I feel like I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place.

His kids are under two (two

His kids are under two (two under two). He has a few years before the whole creating memories comes into play and by then his son will be older.

I don't disagree about taking his current family, but I bet, when push comes to shove, the new wife opts out.

You are right - she sees me

You are right - she sees me as a bank machine, and nothing more. She has not shown any interest in accepting her part in the downfall of our relationship, and she wants me to suffer as a result. I gave her the freedom as it was the right thing to do - I could not willfully destroy someone else. And I will not stoop to that. I could never look myself in the mirror or my kids in the eye if I had acted in such a way.

The issue is that my ex is

The issue is that my ex is not a qualified person, so it would be unlikely that she would have found employment that provided sponsorship. No sponsorship means no visa. I have no legal right to sponsor my ex. I can sponsor my son.

Was it over before she left? As my sponsorship would have ended, she would have had 30 days to find something and get accommodation. As an unskilled worker, she could not compete vs Indian and Filipino workers who would ask for a quarter of the salary for the same job. She knew that once she earned a cent, she would only get child support and no alimony. It was not a situation that left her in a safe place. I tried to appease her, and let her go back. I made a grave mistake.

She definitely did the right

:jawdrop: :jawdrop:

She definitely did the right thing by leaving.

Agreed - I felt I did the

Agreed - I felt I did the right thing in letting her go. I did not want to destroy her. However, it feels like a mistake at times as she has decided to behave in such a way since.

I don't believe in humiliating or hurting people - I try to act in a way that is fair, but I am having times where I regret not pushing my advantage home. It's now come back to bite me

You are in a prison of your

You are in a prison of your own making.

If you don't want your son to visit you and your family, then don't make those arrangements. Don't lie to your wife and tell her you're a victim of your ex, though, that makes you look weak and ineffective. Just be honest and tell her, "Look, wife, I want to have you and our kids over here, but in my free time, I want to go and visit my son and my ex." It's not nice to hear, but you won't have the ongoing conflict you have now. And it's much easier to put blinders on in life - only acknowledge your older son when you're not distracted by your wife and other children, and vice versa.

If you DO want your son to be part of your life and family, well, then do what you can, together with your wife and life partner, to make that happen. Also not easy, but at least you're in control of the conflict and you can be satisfied with yourself as a person no matter the outcome.

I definitely want my son to

I definitely want my son to be with me and my family. I have made that very clear. My wife also wants that too. However, I do have an ex who is hellbent on causing me inconvenience. I am trying to stop my son being used as a pawn, but I will have to admit at some point that my non confrontational approach isn't woeking...

I can't have my son visit - due to the terms of the divorce, he cannot visit my home in Middle East as it is not a Hague Convention country.

So then your whole family

So then your whole family goes with you when you go to your son's country for visitation. Or to another acceptable country for visitation/family holiday.

You sounded as though your reasons for not pursuing legal avenues to try to make this situation easier for you and your wife was because of your fear that your ex will continue to say hateful things about you to your son or even be succesful at withholding your son entirely from you.

You cannot control your fears, but you certainly cannot allow them to control you. I'm very sorry you have an ex willing to damage your son because she thinks it will hurt or control you. It must be terrifying, and exhausting, to live through. If you cannot get a legal right to your child sorted out, then I think it would be such a tragedy to find that by focussing on one son, you somehow lost your wife and other children.

Make sure your wife is on board, that you are treating her as your equal partner in life, and that you are BOTH doing what is objectively right. Worrying about your ex and what she might do... is keeping your energy and attention on her. If I were your wife, I'd be hurt to know how important your ex is to you.

You keep saying it's about your son... but you have put your ex in charge. She's not in charge of you, your life, your family, your wife or your other children.

What do you suggest he do,

What do you suggest he do, practically? There is zero chance that his son will be visiting him in his country. He spends less than a mouth a year seeing his son. The other 11 months he is with his new family. Yes, they don't get much holiday time, but he is there for dinners, weekends, stories at bedtime, bath time, etc.

I actually see a slightly different scenario than you. I see a father being pulled the wrong direction by his new wife. Given how little time he sees his son, she should be encouraging that time and not behaving like a petulant child. (ie the silent treatment)

Practically? I can't imagine

Practically? I can't imagine that it's easy. But I can't imagine being married to a guy, having a family together, and never actually getting any vacation together. That's my favourite part of my marriage, when DH doesn't have anything else going on.

So I would suggest that the entire family go on vacation together. And that the dad spends some time with each of his children, and some with all of his children. Because I would imagine that this dad works as much as my DH, which means there is time to read two stories daily to his kid. That is a great 20 minutes that is the foundation for a relationship that this dad doesn't have with his oldest, for sure.

But when DH is on vacation, he takes DD out for the day sometimes. This dad will never do that with two of his children according to the current plan.

I would try to include the oldest in my family life, as I would if he lived with me full-time, rather than try to make custody-time super-special daddy-time.

I don't know if that is objectively the correct approach, but it would be right for me and my family.

this a million times. I

this a million times.

I think your wife is actually trying to destroy your relationship with your child (or at least she doesn't really care)

I am also guessing that her standard of living has gone way up as I use to work in HR for a US based company that has 1000s of employees in the Middle East. What happened to you (accidental pregnancy) isn't that unusual. I think she manipulated then and would like to keep manipulating you now.

Get marriage counseling now. See if she changes her behavior. Guessing she won't

I really think you have my

I really think you have my wife misunderstood. She is more than happy to travel to Europe if we can get visa.. I think right now she is feeling the strain of looking after 2 kids under 2on her own, with me halfway around the world.

. Before we got together she was working for a major uni and traveling a lot - she had a good life in her own country. If anything, she has less in the Middle East than she had back at home! She gave up everything to be with me.

She was traveling in former

She was traveling in former Soviet bloc. Visa free regimes for her. Europe is a whole new ballgame.

My wife and I discussed the issue last night. She has agreed that she n eds to manage her emotions better, and is going to put things to one side to ensure that I am focused on enjoying my time with my son. I hope that this continues for next two weeks. I think they just need to meet to put an end to this.

I have a lawyers appointment tomorrow with a lawyer in exam home country...hope that we can at least move things forward now.

Do you correct your sons

Do you correct your sons misperceptions of your wife that your ex is filling his head with?

Yes I do. But the issue is he

Yes I do. But the issue is he feels he has to be loyal to his mum so he locks up when the topic comes into play.

He can't cut her off --

He can't cut her off -- because he travels to Europe as part of his job. And he may risk losing his passport or being arrested.

He can take his new family to visit when he goes to see his son. But there doesn't seem to be any upside to that really.

He has three children, not

He has three children, not one.

Am I reading some kind of

Am I reading some kind of sarcasm between the lines?

Thanks for clarifying. I'd

Thanks for clarifying. I'd love for there to be some legal structure re what I can/cannot do. It is outrageous that a child can be used as an instrument to inflict pain. They do not know any better.

I'm going to insist on seeing

I'm going to insist on seeing medical records. If she doesn't provide them, I will assume that she is trying to hide something.. I want full access to medical records to see if there is a psychological or medical reason for son not to meet my family. If there is not a reason, I will just push ahead and introduce my family as there is no reason not to. If she refuses, I will look to apply pressure - either financially or through the courts.

I think that is only real option...

I agree. She has put fear

I agree. She has put fear into him. I have to at least find out if the professionals feel he shouldn't see my family. If they feel that, I will ask for an independent appraisal and then look to do as much as possible to improve his mental state. That is what matters.

I couldn't afford to return

I couldn't afford to return financially - due to my line of work being based predominantly around London I'd struggle to have enough money to support 2 families. And that in turn poses issues regarding immigration status of my wife...Not as simple as just getting on a plane and going back. If it were that easy, I'd have done that.

Hi there. Ex and I are from

Hi there. Ex and I are from different countries. I'm a Brit, and she is from a diff European country. We met in the U.K., got married there and moved to Middle East.

I don't expect my son to

I don't expect my son to visit Middle East. I want my ex to allow my son to meet my family and we will travel to make it happen.

With regards to standards - In Europe, we were barely surviving. In Middle East, she wanted for nothing - I gave her everything I could, but it was never enough.I think she wants Middle East standard in Europe...

Surely, you are not with your

Surely, you are not with your ex 24/7 when you go to visit your son.

I'm assuming you fly in, book a hotel room, pick him up, spend X number of days hanging out with him, then return him to mom before heading to the airport.

If that's the case, how can mom control what you do or who you're with during that time?

If I don't leave the country,

If I don't leave the country, I have someone basically stalking me. Last few times, she said I have too little notice so I had to take my son to his football games and his choir practice. This is despite me given over 2-3 weeks notice. As she knew where I'd be, either her friends would be spying on us or she would be there herself...it feels like she wants to suffocate my relationship. I have told her now that each weekend I come will be me flying in, taking my son, and me flying to my family in London. It's the only way I can guarantee that our time is not interfered or monitored. It is all in writing and I quote the agreement in our divorce papers that. 2 weeks is enough notice.

She controls my son through her continued influence upon him. Even if he is with me, he is wary of upsetting her. He only really switches off if he is well away from her. Currently we are in the U.K., and after almost 4 days he hasn't asked once about her and says he prefers being in UK with my family. I really think this is what he misses, and what my ex is scared of - being in a family unit and feeling mutual understanding and respect and love for each other. I think my ex is panicked that my son will want to be in a family unit if my wife is with us - she is scared of being replaced. I have to be clear - My wife is his SM - not his mum! My ex will always be my sons mum and deserves respect for that...or maybe I am reading too much into my son being happy to be around me and my parents....

I suggest once you can get

I suggest once you can get your wife a visa -- have her meet you in GB and you bring your son there.

As to doing the activities with your son, I realize it is uncomfortable, but it is so important for you to see what he is doing, meet his friends, etc. It actually makes it easier for you to converse with him when you aren't around. Does this make sense?

I think you need to work with your employer to get some flexibility in terms of weekends etc. Try arranging your travel so you can hop over and see him between two business obligations.

opps double post

I feel desperately sorry for

I feel desperately sorry for this boy. I work with kids whose parents are often at loggerheads with each other and it has a terrible impact on them. I think I will exit from this debate as I think always the child's needs are paramount, and it seems that this child is being offered three parents- when being in a stable place where just the one would suffice. We cannot always be in control of other people's actions, and there is no dream of perfect family life that can ever be attained. We have to deal with complex situations with responsibility and common sense. I feel in this instance it may be sadly lacking.

I get where you are coming

I get where you are coming from fairy. However, we do need to draw a line at which point my ex has not got a right to dictate how I spend my life and how I spend my time with my child.

My son and I get on great and he loves spending time with me - of my ex stopped being so obstructive, I could spend even more time with him - all of the 4 weeks, as opposed to 2 and the weekends. Yes, it is idealistic and probably somewhat unrealistic - but if I don't ask for more, I will not get anything...

My wife has massively changed her tune thanks to this thread...so it is now just my ex and I differing on our approaches...

Oops double post...

Latest update - huge thanks

Latest update - huge thanks to all the input and advice - as well as very valid criticism and concerns. I think one of the major issues I had is resolving quite rapidly - my wife has really started to look at things differently, and I cannot thank you enough for your input

My wife has backed off since I arranged a lawyer in my exes country to look into the intricacies of the case - Because she is now seeing assertive action, she is a lot happier. she has said it is best to leave it in the hands of a professional who can cut through any bluff and rhetoric and get to the truth to find the best way forward for my son and I to have a proper relationship. - We have had 2 good conversations about it in the last two evenings thanks to the directions people have given me in this thread. I am relieved to have got a lot of this off my shoulders and out in the open. It's a relief to have her focused on me getting my son in a good place, and for her to understand that it will not be a quick fix...she is genuinely wanting me to have a good relationship with my son, and is willing to compromise providing I am taking a proactive approach to a solution - rather than appeasement. She too sees that my appeasement has not brought a definitive solution and a new approach is required.

I really am very grateful for all of your input on this

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Stuck between rock and a hard place