Narcassistic mother manipulating daughter
After 7 long year my SO has finally realised that his ex wife is a narcassist. She doesn't just show traits, if you Google the definition it fully defines her! This is a huge turning point in our relationship and whilst he feels nervous, he also feels like a cloud has been lifted....all good news.
Now for the tricky but, where we need your help and advice please.
My SD is absolutely manipulated and controlled by her mother. She has had years of hearing I broke up their marraige (I didn't), I'm thick and lower class. She has been told her father prefers my children to her and that he is a bully. SD fully believes this and as a result is alienating herself from her father, and also showing traits of her mother. She puts herself first, emotionally abuses me and her father, but in retrospect her words and actions are those of her mother. Years of emotional abuse and drop feeding negative comments means my SD puts her mother on a pedestal.
SD lived with us for 2 years (she hasn't lived with her mother fully since the end of the marraige to my SO, as she has otherwise been in boarding school) and her mother did everything to make it fail, which it did! It was never going to work and SD played her mother and my SO against each other and me continuously!!
Her mother is vying for more money from us (she already had half a million) we now have nothing other than our home....which has threatened to try and take, and when we have said no to her demands (first time from my SO), she played the victim and accused us of bullying....stating she only wants contact re our SD, nothing else.....playing the victim and all ongoing attempts at emotional control against my SO. He's being so amazing, but our SD needs protecting. Will she ever see what her mother is like?
My fear is that my SO needs to heal, which is going to take time....(the realisation of her narcassistic control is a new thing), and until he can manage how he deals with her he is risking of losing his daughter even more.
How can I support my SO? How should he deal with his ex wife? How can we help SD see what her mother is like?
Any advice gratefully appreciated. Apologies for any spelling mistakes....I'm using my phone.
Your SO does indeed need to
Your SO does indeed need to heal.
It’s probably a good idea to let BM show her true colours to her daughter with regards to the narcissism. Teenagers don’t know enough about how narcissism works to conciously process how to deal with it.
If you spell stuff out it could backfire - and the narcissist will be waiting to play her game.
pick up the pieces when she needs you to.
It is possible that she will be less influenced when she is an adult. Maybe a boyfriend might point it out or something when she’s older.
Your SO needs to have as
Your SO needs to have as little contact with his ex as possible, and only about the child. Let her make threats, let her take it to court - she's not going to take your house.
Your SD is a victim of parental alienation, it's common with narcissistic mothers. You can't help her see anything, your SO should just be steady and consistent for her, not let her abuse him, and hopefully, as she gets older, she will begin to see that her mother really doesn't care much about her at all. Right now, she's trying to please her mother and make sure she doesn't leave her.
The best way to support your SO is to make sure you help him see and not believe the distorted nonsense that the ex is going to spew at him.
Parental Alienation from NPD Mother
That is great news that your SO is finally seeing through the FOG (fear, obligation, guilt) that his NPDex has tried to instill in him. My situation mirrors yours, in that my SO finally got his ex-wife's number and disengaged entirely. This took time, as they have 3 kids and they were teenagers when I came into the picture. My SO is a kind, gentle and generous person, which made him a target of the crazy BM a long time ago. She used her children to leverage money from him and pity from kids for years. The underlying system was this: give me money or I'll harm your kids while looking like a hero/victim in their eyes. She would manufacture a drama/problem that a child would not be able to see through, and then "rescue" them from their horrible, inept, "weak" father. His weakness, for sure, was his kids. But they are older now: 18, 20, 22. The older two, girls, are very wrapped up in their mother's craziness and behave much like her. The youngest, a boy, ignores everyone, which is working out well for him. He's anti-politic/gossip.
It's taken my SO many years to shore up the damage done to him and he continues to try to do so for his daughters, but success is slow, and often ineffective. He has disengaged entirely from the BM, which is easier now that there is no "coparenting" needed beyond college costs, which he pays for entirely. His disengagement is the single most effective tool. He "parents" without regard for the BM. We live in a state with child support laws that go to age 21, but the last time she took him to court (her favorite thing to do), she lost most of her CS as she was caught lying about her finances.
SO blocked her toxic text messages. BM wanted to stay in touch on text - her communication noose for both SO and kids - on the pretense of shared parenting duties. But a review of 3 years of messages showed zero logistical exchanges, only ranting about what a horrible parent he is, or else she would give dates for things like holiday travel but the dates were always wrong. This was her way of staying in control of everyone's schedule, screwing up events and then pointing the finger at his "ineptitude." And the kids would ape her language and behavior. The psychological abuse of her kids is astounding, and yet they cling to her. It's easier to reject the stable parent/my SO as they know he loves them unconditionally and then chase the abusing parent, who showers them with love and affection when they do her bidding and rejects them harshly when they don't side with her. It's hard to be rejected by one's mother, and I feel for them on that score. But they will have to find their way out of that in time, or not. They are adults now and their decisions are not without consequence, mostly, not having a good relationship with the one person who cares about them. It's hard to watch. Over and over again. Their own abuse of my SO has diminished some, and it's clear they are conflicted since the messaging they received from their mother is wildly out of sync with their reality. His consistency as a parent is what creates the conflict for them. I hope this inner conflict continues and they (girls) will see beyond the brainwashing tactics of their mother, but there is no guarantee.
Advice? SO and you should be entirely disengaged from the BM in all ways possible. No response to anything. Your SO should be the parent he wants to be without influence from the BM. They do not have to agree on what is best for the kids. That requires engagement and if she is anything like the one I'm dealing with, a terrible parent and person. Why support any of those values? When they are with him, they are with him only and with his rules. If she wants to take him to court again, she can do that. Just make sure all record keeping is tight, keep tabs on any issues, financial, emotional everything with the kids (with dates) and buckle up. The tighter your ship, the more blow back you will get from her and kids. But it's time limited. If there are no rewards for crummy behavior, it will slow down and dwindle. All of this is easier said than done and I feel for your situation. Been there a long time. But the BM largely gave up the fight when she had no one to fight with. And the kids do notice. The older they get, and the more exposure they have to other people, their false belief system is failing them. It will be hard for your SO to hold on and not react in the long run, but I think it is the only hope that the SD will come around. When parental alienation is involved, I think there is almost nothing you can say to counter the bad messages from the alienating parent. My guess is the SD will threaten all kinds of things to get her way, even if it is destructive to herself and others, all egged on by the BM. This was my situation. I think you just have to live/behave/respect your own values in your home, expect those values to be respected without wavering, and ignore the BM. And then hope.
There is no happy answer
I am dealing with something very similar. The BM had a kid from a previous guy. I watched once the kid started high school he took a giant downward spiral to the point that he , didnt pass high school and was kicked out once the child support stopped coming. He moved in with his maternal grandparents and within 6 months he graduated from high school, got a drivers license, a car, and a job. All due to being away from the narcissist.
But now i see it in the SD. My DH is the BD and he really cares about his kids. But he also knows his exwife and what she did to him. Then 3 or 4 years ago the SD treated and spoke to her Dad like her mother did/does. And he froze and his knee jerk reaction kicked in of make her happy so she goes away and the little brat got this smile on her face like holy crap if worked. Then later that week out of the blue he said i cant believe she acted just like her mother, it really freaked me out. And that is when he really just gave up on ever having a relationship with his kids. He said they are too far gone maybe when they are in their 20 or 30s i will see if they will want to accept me.
I trust the BM and SD as far as i can throw them. The SD will take pictures of me cause she thinks she is that slick at it. Then will put unflattering filters on them and send them or post them for BM to see then the fast texting starts and the smiles and giggles and the phone is covered so no one can see. My DH confronted the BM about it at first flat out denied it and we were the crazy ones for thinking that, then it turned into that she would never take pictures of me and do that. And there was the flaw. We never said she took the pictures. The SD did but never denied laughing at photos of me taken by SD. Then the next weekend the kids were over the SS starts taking my picture with his phone and making a sarcastic comment. I said oh picture time. I got out my phone and did the multi pictures in a row. So they could not pose and were not great pictures. Then i looked at the pictures and smirked at them then put my phone down and said that was boring. That was the last i saw any phones pointed my way.
The slippery slope the SD is on is not good. She is on 4 different mood medications cause the BM was diagnosed bipolar but she is really NPD and she wants the SD to be bipolar too. I know the SD will see through the game her mom is playing when she is older but i am worried that she will be consumed by a lot of anger. Cause the SD just wants to be accepted and cared about by her mom but her mom is just using her.
The BM loves munchausen by proxy situations so she has the SD believing she is bipolar, suicidal, crippling anxiety and apparently the negative self talk is now hearing voices. I think the SD got the voices idea from one of the kids she met during her last trip to the psych ward. She refers to that places as vaca stay cause there are no expectations put on her there. That was a giant red flag. But she only gets 1 week stays. If she acts schizophrenic she can get a longer stay. So the SD already realizes that if she gets away to a place where mom cant constantly call her and knot her up she feels better. At dads house mom calls and texts multiple times a day. And you can hear the agitation grow in the SD voice.
But you were looking for advise on how to deal with the insane behavior. What they want most is for you to believe their game. What i started to do was not to be critical of the SD and act like all the lies she says are true and i am none the wiser. Then that got her comfortable enough to talk to me or ask me questions. so she thought she could dig up more dirt for mom. They find kindness to be a sign of weakness. Then they start telling things about mom they arent suppose to let you know but it wont be the whole story. So then i would make sure to ask if their mom was doing ok when she had any scary medical things happen. Then they realize you are being nice without an ulterior motive and that is just boring. They like the drama but they also want to be the victim. So let them be the victim sad sack but dont give them the drama. Pretty soon you are too boring and they leave you alone. I hope this helps. Parental alienation is beibg recognized by more judges and courts than it was a few years ago.