MY Ex and Pop Warner
I know this isn't exactly about a blended family issue but I really need some guidence.
My BS10 has been begging to play tackle football for 3 years. I finally enrolled him in Pop Warner this summer as he goes to a small private school that did not offer football. I had told his dad what I was planning and he was fine with it because he knows how much BS wanted to play. He's the excessive Disney Daddy.... whatever BS wants, BS gets.
We just finished 3 hell weeks (2 hrs per day 5 days a week) of practice. This is week 4 with 3 days of practice and the first game this Sat. It is brutal. Some of the boys cry during practice and some end up throwing up. And it's HOT. 105-110 degrees here. SS is playing too. Both are first year and on different teams due to age difference this year.
Well, last Friday practice, they were doing gruelling drills and one kid was throwing up and crying doing what they call 'bear crawls'. The coaches just told him to "keep going - you can do it" and basically made him finish. The parent whom I was sitting next too was upset but knew the kid needed to tough it out and let the coach handle it. The kid was almost to the end and he made it with the encouragement of the coach.
So the above situation really affected my ex I think. He asked for the coaches phone number on a message over the weekend but I never called him to give it to him. He's been to practice every day for 3 weeks and didn't have it? Not my problem.
So, last night the Ex calls and leaves a message saying to not bother packing BS's football gear because he wasn't taking him to practice tonight (it's his night). He says he wanted to spend 'quality time' with him. Well, my a$$. I mean, sure, he wants to spend quality time but that wasn't the issue. He has a problem with BS going to practice and being subjected to such cruel and unusual punishment. He told him he thinks the 'bear crawls' and other stuff they make them do is much to hard for these 'little' kids and he shouldn't be doing them. Ii asked BS if he wanted to go to practice and he said yes. I told him he needed to call daddy back and tell him. He did and had to listen to his dad rant about it but in the end, dad agreed to take him because that is what BS wanted. Lo and behold, this morning, BS changed his mind. He wants to blow off practice. He didn't want to bother packing his football bag because he has to take it to school cuz daddy picks him up.
So, I know I can't dictate what EH does on his time. I can't make him take him to practice. I'm the one that forked out the $200 for sign up, and all the money for the other gear he needed not to mention the rediculous fund raising that is required. Dad bought his cleats. But what he's teaching this kid is goingn to carry over for a lifetime I believe. I told BS when he said he didn't want to go to practice that he was not giving it 100% and there will be consequences and that I didn't want to hear him complain how the other boys are better than him (because they will be!) and how he has to sit out some of his first game because he didn't get the required practice in. I know this is only one practice and in the grand scheme of things, no biggie.... the thing is, once he does it, I think it will become more of a habit. And it's just an example of how he is not encouraged to 'give it your all' and 'don't quit' from his dad. He's being tought that when it's hard, give up.
I'm so frustrated. There are so many issues with dad and I'm really considering getting an attorney to try to change some things and see if I can force him to take him since he agreed to it to begin with.
Thoughts anyone? Do I have a leg to stand on?
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Comments
Not really since it is
Not really since it is extra-curricular. We have the same problem with Karate. We pay for it and BM won't take him on her week. Happens all the time, lawyer said not worth fighting over. Judges won't care about it.
Also, I kind of agree with the dad and it seems a little harsh for a rec team...We have had a couple of kids die here in the south at Football practice from the heat. Not worth it...
Frankly, I'm on your DH's
Frankly, I'm on your DH's side. Making kids cry is one thing, but making them practice until they throw up and then making them crawl through that puke to finish? Way over the top, in my opinion. I would be having a dicussion with that coach, and my child wouldn't be returning until things calmed down.
Sounds like a general
Sounds like a general parenting issue more than custody. I was an athlete, then a coach, now an SM and I even struggle with this. If you trust the coach, then I would trust his judgement. Coaches don't want to have anything serious happen to these kids and they also usually know what kids can endure. We adults forget how much energy we had as kids. Can you try to set up a meeting or conference call with your EX, the coach and yourself? maybe your Ex will feel better if he knows what sort of things the coach looks for or monitors to know if a player is in danger. I also see your side too...it's a horrible standard to set by letting a child start participating in something and then quit with no consequence. good luck.
Thanks logan, a conference
Thanks logan, a conference sounds like a reasonable idea. But my ex isn't reasonable. He's extremely unreasonable and completely irrationale and carrying a conversation with him is exhausting. I try to avoid any conversation with him if I can help it. I considered calling the coach myself and giving him a heads up. Maybe he could proactively have this conversation with EH himself. I'm sure he's not the first parent they've dealt with on this issue.
IMO for rec that is WAY too
IMO for rec that is WAY too harsh, and he's 10...what's the need to compete so brutally and excessive focus on "not quitting" at this age. He has a lifetime ahead for that. It's over the top.
I think between normal sports or school and helping them focus to keep going is good...I've seen those excessive coaches yelling at young kids...IMO that is not a place I want my child in, so I'm with dad on this. Is it possible to find a less agressive/competitive team....does the name/reputation make it more of a priority then what they actually are learning? You can't force him to take him and honestly I think you both should find a more suitable place for your son.
After hearing of quite a few kids dying from heat exhaustion this summer in sports...F the coach on making a 10yr old throw up and keep going. Seriously...wth? And honestly the practice times are incredibly excessive-for that age level. I'd look for another tackle football team that approaches it as rec should be approached.
How does he focus on anything else, have downtime, playtime, homework w/that kind of practice time?
and I'm really considering
and I'm really considering getting an attorney to try to change some things and see if I can force him to take him since he agreed to it to begin with.
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Whoa!! I think you are being a bit dramatic / controlling all the way around. Sorry, JMHO.
PS…Practice for 2 hours a day, 5 days a week, for 10 year olds in 105-110 temperatures is the most assanine thing I have ever heard of. Honestly, I don’t think they are letting the High school do that much right now due to the heat and fear of heat related DEATH.
I pray that none of those 10 year olds die due to the parents and coaches stupidity. Use some sense people!!
Willow, I'd like to mention
Willow, I'd like to mention that the 2 hrs a day, 5 days a week was only for the last 3 weeks and was for the purpose of conditioninng. So practice WAS brutal. Conditioning excercises ARE brutal.. for anyone. That is just what it takes to get ready to play football. Football requires a lot of strength and endurance and these kids have been sitting on their butts playing video games for most of the summer. This week is 3 days as they are learning how to hit (and not get hurt) and plays. After this week, it will go to 2 days per week and Sat games.
I am on them daily and consisently to ensure they drink enough water and eat the right foods to ensure they are well hydrated and have the energy to handle it. This is what I CAN control (at least when he's with me).
Your comment about me being dramatic and controlling...I think you are being a bit judgemental based on limited imformation. You have no idea all the crap his dad does and what we have to deal with that is in addition to the crap he's doing now with football and I don't have the time to note every thing we are dealing with.
My SS11 just started Pop
My SS11 just started Pop Warner tackle football this August but I haven't heard about any throwing up, crying etc. and we're in Florida, so it is disgustingly hot. DH played football when he was a teenager and remembers the intense training, throwing up etc. I think if your XH has concerns over the training, he should talk to the coach. I don't think him unilaterally deciding to not take him to practice is the answer. Sounds like what our BM would do. SS missed two days of practice because BM took him out of town to see relatives and as a result of missing those days, SS isn't on the 1st string squad whereas, prior to missing practice, the coach was always picking him during practice to execute plays. Another story altogether, I know, but I believe your XH encouraging him to blow off practice is teaching him the wrong things i.e. when things are tough, just give up. This is how BM and her husband are with BM's own stepkids and they try to influence SS in the same way. I understand people's concerns over kids being sick and it being tough on them, but those concerns should be addressed with the coach first PRIOR to just deciding to blow off practice.
Thanks for the comments. It
Thanks for the comments. It helps to hear from someone in a similar experience. My DH also played in Pop Warner and started being the assistant coach on SS's team. He's having issues with SS as he's got issues with the hitting part. He's afraid of getting hurt
At home, DH is trying to teach him how to hit and how to not be afraid and he's working with both SS and BS to teach them.
I guess I'm just disappointed. BS has wanted to do this for so long and now I just feel he's being discouraged by his dad. BS LOVES football. He wants to be a quarterback for the NFL when he grows up! He has driven my crazy about playing for so long and now I finally let him and pay all this money and invest all this time and it's going to go right in the toilet because of his idiot dad.
I should tell EH to call the coach but I really hate talking to him. Either way, his MO is to just complain to me and not take him to practice instead of discussing objectively with others and making an informed decision.
Willow, I'd like to mention
Willow, I'd like to mention that the 2 hrs a day, 5 days a week was only for the last 3 weeks and was for the purpose of conditioninng. So practice WAS brutal. Conditioning excercises ARE brutal.. for anyone. That is just what it takes to get ready to play football
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I know what “two a days” are. But they are for High School and College. And right now, most are not doing two a days because of the excessive heat. But you are making 10 year olds do it. I am still trying to wrap my brain around your post.
Your comment about me being dramatic and controlling...I think you are being a bit judgemental based on limited imformation.
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Of course I am being judgmental, and of course it is based on limited info. I am going off what YOU wrote on THIS blog. Sorry to come off as harsh, but I am still finding it hard to believe that there are 10 year olds being made to cry and puke in this 105-110 heat. All in the name of a sport. I would not take that chance with my kids life.
I know I'd pull my kid. For
I know I'd pull my kid.
For REC? Sheesh. And I've had/have kids in competitive/all-star athletics.
This is just kinda nuts. For TEN year olds?? Yikes.
You think 2 hours a day is
You think 2 hours a day is too much? HA! My BS13 has done football camps in 100 degree heat where they practice 6 hours a day! 3 practices 2 hours each EVERY DAY for 4 days. If a child is SERIOUS about sports THIS IS WHAT IT TAKES. My boy has been playing since he was 10 as well. It's the nature of the beast. To the OP, just make sure your boy is hydrated. DRINK, DRINK, DRINK. He'll be ok.
Thanks Unfreakingreal. I do!
Thanks Unfreakingreal. I do! I am the biggest nag on practice days about drinking. Before school started I would try to work from home those days and I would give them a goal to drink so much every half hour and I'd be reminding them all day long (I had to or they would forget to drink!) My boys have never puked but they've definately been in tears. It is HARD work. I'm so glad someone else understands this. And it's not like I forced him to play. He WANTED to play. He BEGGED me to play for 3 years! But now his pussy-a$$ dad wants to teach him how to punk out instead of being tough and confident and how to excel at something that takes hard work.
This is also the same dad that during a football 'tournement' during the summer which was like you described which they played 4 games in one day in 100+ degrees... he complained that his kid different get as much play time as other kids. Stupid a$$. He pissed the coach off before he even started on the team!
Yes pissing off the coach is
Yes pissing off the coach is a no no. They'll make an example out of your boy and bench him all season. Try explaining to your Ex that this is not the example he wants to set for his son. Quitting is NOT an option and it's a very bad lesson to teach him. Tell him that anything worth having is hard work and this will benefit your child in so many ways. If he refuses to take him to practice then pick him up and take him yourself. I won't let anything come between my son & his football.
I don't have a choice
I don't have a choice Unfreakingreal. He gets to decide what he does on 'his' time. He wouldn't give him to me on his time.
What other recourse do I have but to just sit back and allow my son to learn the consequences of this behavior. Unfortunately, he will be the one paying for it and I feel completely helpless.
I think this will go one of two ways... either my son will learn to be a lazy a$$ and give up easily when things get tough or someday (like his dad and blame everyone/thing else for their problems) or, just maybe (hoping), he'll realize his dad is a bad influence and he calls him out on it. What's the likelihood?
My son played YAFL from the
My son played YAFL from the time he was 8 until he could play high school football. He loved it! There were plenty of times that he and his teammates were throwing up and practicing in the heat, and doing the dreaded bear crawls. This was nothing new to me nor to my son! Tackle football is tough at any age. I don't think a child should be signed up unless they truly enjoy the sport!
My BD14 plays soccer and had high school tryouts through July! It was hot! We live in the desert!! There were many girls throwing up as well there.
I think this teaches the kids to be disciplined. Your ex agreed to have him signed up. What did he think he was signing up for? Football is very physical and I think a 10 year old is well aware of this. I'd be really mad if my ex didn't take my BD to practice and that caused her to miss out on game time!!
So, what do I do Eagle Eye?
So, what do I do Eagle Eye? Would a judge ever side with me and say, hey dad, you agreed now take him to pracice! How do I counteract what his dad is teaching him? My son wants to play but without the encouragement, I'm afraid it's just an easy out. He doesn't have the maturity yet to step up with his passion and say "no dad, I'm going to practice".
My BS13 plays football.
My BS13 plays football. Plenty of times he's come home and told me how half the team was puking all over the field. Football is a VERY physical sport. One time his ankles swelled up like balloons. I had to take him to the doctor. The doctor said his muscles were inflamed. I was a little freaked out but it comes with the territory. Pop Warner is an excellent program. Your Ex needs to man up and let his boy do what he has to do on the field. Getting all up at a coach can backfire on your son. Coaches hate that.
On the leg to stand on
On the leg to stand on question. Probably not. Our CO is clear. Visitation is entirely at the discretion of the NCP, he do what he wants with the kid during visitation time, and the CP has no say in what the NCP does with their visitation time.
And vise versa. I believe that this will be the case in most courts.
As for the practice. There is a reason why the coaches push the kids hard during pre-season practice. It is to minimize the chance that they will get hurt during the season.
Now, there is a fine line between a tough practice and an excessive practice. You are at the practices you know where that line it and if the coaches have crossed it.
Sounds like your XH has some issues with letting his son be a boy.
We had SS several sports. He did not want to be. He would have much rather sat at home playing Poke Mon, Yu Gi Oh, video games or some other stupid fantasy crap. His BioDad is in to all of that stuff and that is about all they do during his summer, winter and spring visitation. He has no specific memories of playing those stupid games with his BiODad and will never remember a good time he had playing a video game or fantasy card game with his SpermIdiot. He has very clear and fond memories of his baseball, football, tennis and swim teams and games and his mom and I there to cheer him on.
I would tell XH that if he wants your son out of Football, you expect a check for 100% of the costs you incurred to get him started. You probably won't get it and it is unlikely that a court would back your request but it does make a point.
IMO of course.