I hate that term - kids being kids - every person I have heard use it, is describing something despicable that their child is doing and making excuses, "it's just kids being kids". Doing things like pulling out new plants in a public park, teasing a deaf person, calling a chubby class mate fatso etc. Kids being kids - um no. Kids being assholes.

I have never known an 18yo who could afford a "manor".

I totally agree with you. People do NOT parent their kids like they used to. I work in a store that hires high school kids for small jobs...I would say that only 1 in 10 is worth anything..the rest are spoiled, entitled brats with ZERO work ethic. Literally standing around doing nothing during down time, scoffing when they are asked to do any work, saying things like, "well, I only have 15 minutes left.." etc etc..its shocking! I remember my first job..I wanted to impress and work very hard! How can these kids be so BLAH and rude about being employed!

Also..it seems to be even worse with younger kids. So spoiled and entitled. The way they talk to their parents..wow.

I was born in the 80's, so I am not super ancient or anything..Maybe my expectations are too high. Maybe people have always been this way and I am jsut now old enough to notice it.

The MAJORITY of teens/young adults are better behaved than older adults, in my experience. I dunno how much interaction you all have with the general public. But kids are not the problem.

My son and I got peed on - yes I said peed on - by a ten year old girl at Disney last week. Granted, she didn't stand up and piss all over us, but she proceeded to relieve herself on a bench seat we were sharing with her and her mom on a ride that takes place on the water where your boat rocks gently. It was all over my butt and my legs as well as my feet as I was sitting directly next to her.

Was the girl visibly disabled? No. Was the girl acting like a normal child prior to boaring the ride? Yes. In fact, she had coherent conversations with my on on multiple topics. I did not sense anything to be abnormal with her prior to this. The mother however acted like she was from ghettoville cracktown.

Did her mother act mortified? No. Did the girl act horrified? No.

Did the mother get shitty with me when I asked her if she going to clean this mess up? Yes.

Did the mother call me little miss tattle tale when I told the unload ride workers about it? Yes.

If the parents aren't willing to be examples, the kids are going to suck too. I fear for my son's well being. He's ten as well. This girl is his peer.

When the woman called me a tattle tale and got ghetto with me, I thought my son was going to fight an adult. He stood up for me in a way I've never seen a child react. I was so proud of him. He didn't lose his temper, he didn't yell, he didn't cry. He just firmly told that woman and her daughter that his mother did the right thing and that respect is earned and they didn't earn anything that day.

So in general, people suck. ME ME ME ME ME. Sucks.

I'm not so sure the "brat syndrome" and "kids being kids" is the whole problem. I mean, my DH's stepmom raised her children in the era you're thinking of. Her 2 sons won't speak to her since she remarried after her late husband's death, and her daughter (now mid-30s) still lives with her (along with her husband and 2 kids).

BM's own mother doesn't know who BM's father is. She has 4 kids by 4 different men. As soon as her kids were old enough and able, they moved as far away from her as they could.

I know plenty of bratty kids, but I know even more nasty adults. I think we look back on the "good old days" of lower divorce rates and less broken families with blinders on. You're also speaking of a time when domestic abuse was tolerated, women's and other civil rights were just a pipe dream, and the economy was booming in the post-war period.

And I agree about the lazy technology age our kids are being raised in .. when I was a kid, I LIVED on my bike outside ALL summer long. But times have changed .. it's just not SAFE in most areas to send kids unsupervised for hours on end anymore.

I'll just say this. There's a fashion show (makeover) my kids and I like to watch. The last two guests have both been women in their early 30s who still live with their parents, are still going to school and still don't know what they are going to do with their lives. Enough said?

I dunno but there's a definite shift away from guidance and discipline towards coddling and acceptance of some very inappropriate behaviors. So many Laws say "You can't do this or that to discipline or guide your kid" but when it grows up and becomes a monster, same Law and society blames the Parents so maybe hands are tied nowadays and so Parents just give up after "time outs" don't work... Even if kid doesn't become a monster, the basics are missing--manners, courtesy, self-awareness, common sense.. I dunno.

Just this morning, the pseudo-SS9 had apparently decided to get some 'appa duice' from the fridge. He had to shuffle things around to get to it and in process, spilled cherry punch all down the refrigerator, fruit, veggie tray and onto the floor. I mean at least a cup full spilled. Then he proceeded to get his juice and went about his business. This was not known until I went to the kitchen for water a few minutes ago and noticed the countertop was full of sticky something. I followed the trail to see if it hit the floor as I'd just mopped yesterday and that's when I spotted the mess. I point this out to DH who's 'mad' and calls SS9 in and asked what happened. Very casually, SS tells him the story about how it spilled when he was getting his juice. SMH! THEN DH asks "next time what should you do?" and he says "I'll tell you when I want juice?" and DH says "right". I'm like "Are ya kidding me??! He's 9; he can get his own damn juice but when he knowingly makes a big ass mess, he can also clean it up!" UGH.

Last visit he broke a personally handmade wooden statue that my friend made of our wedding cake topper (very unique) and the little turd had broken it and then just hid it behind the TV. GAH!

I sometimes wonder if I'm just too out of my element to deal with kids these days. My daughter is grown, she was 18 when I met DH. The SS was 3 or 4. And while I do have nieces and nephews, I don't have to deal with young kids in my daily life and haven't for a while. Before DH, I lived alone with an independent teen and then totally alone when she left, until DH and I married. It was peaceful. Lol So maybe that combined with the total lack of raising the BM does with her brat and DH's permissiveness, it's just too much to deal with. When he's home, BM pays him no attention so she doesn't take the time to teach him how to do anything or correct him when he's lazy and messy. Her house is filthy especially now that she's pregnant- I mean, sink full of dishes, kick a path through clothes and clutter filthy so it's no wonder cleanliness isn't on his list of what matters. Maybe I'm less tolerant or understanding b/c it's not even DH's kid and the BM is not easy to deal with so my mind goes to "why are we dealing with this".

Ugh... I feel like I'm becoming one of the "Get off my lawn!" old farts. Lol

I wonder now looking at DH and BMs broken marriage how much had to do with their kids. Neither one parents, they were too busy pushing parenting to the other and pointing fingers, both were extremely tired of their own damn kids.

Its like, their kids ruined their marriage because they both chose not to parent - I wouldnt' want to live full time with those kids either - its exhausting. One of DH's biggest complaints was as soon as he got home from work, BM just handed him the kids and either left the house or went to her bedroom and never came out until the morning. He was left to feed them and put them to bed with no help. The way I see it is, BM got home from work, picked up the kids from daycare, spent 2 hours with them, and she was done - the pass off. DH spent his 2 hours with them and he was done, bedtime - neither wanted to parent or take care of the kids, they both tried to escape anytime they could. BM would go to a friends place for hours at a time leaving the kids with DH, as soon as she returned DH would go to the store or out of the house for hours to get away - they were both doing exactly the same thing.

They had no marriage, they did nothing together, they slept in different rooms and just tried to shove their kids off on each other any chance they got. Tag you're it!!

Today, BM and DH share 50-50. BM told DH she didn't want the kids but without 50-50 she'd have to pay CS, BM never keeps the kids more than a minute longer than she has to. DH does take them on more than BM will, but he was dumping them on me - when I disengaged, I see that DH doesn't jump up to take the kids any extra time unless he has to now either.

If people would parent their children, their children wouldn't be so difficult to be around, some marriages might last and these kids would grow up to be better adults.

I too am divorced, parenting was one of the key factors in my divorce, plus my XH wouldn't work - those were the 2 big kickers. I didn't like the 'values' my XH was teaching to my children and felt in order to parent my kids the way I wanted to divorce was going to be the key, my children are respectful, polite, care about school - they are also kids, they have fun, but they follow rules, they have lots of friends and the friends parents always gush about how good they are (mom horn tooting here), teachers love them too - because they respect rules and authority and I have boundaries.

Sigh. Anyone pregnant should have to take parenting classes - I guess it really is rocket science.

I COULDN'T AGREE MORE ESM!!!!

The world was and would be a BETTER place when/if parents were and ACTED like parents and kids KNEW their place! IMHO.

It's why as a therapist I really dislike working with kids. It really isn't the kids. Although they are often whiny, spoiled, little brats-it is really the parents-because even when you tell them what they can do to help their child-they don't want to do it. If the solution in anyway implies that they may have done something wrong then they get pissy at you and don't come back. If the solution requires them to put forth any effort again they get pissy and let you know, "hey, this is about the kid. Your supposed to fix them".

Are my own kids spoiled? To a certain degree yes. They have lots of material things, they don't have to walk miles to school in the snow, they've got it pretty easy-BUT they all know how to do their own laundry, vacuum, dust, clean, sweep-my 14 and 15 year olds can make entire meals-my 11 year is still learning. My 15 year old is at her 2nd year of having a job-my 14 year old has applied for 5 jobs already this summer (still waiting on someone to call). They are all honor roll students, go to Church, and do volunteer to help with Church and school activities.

Then I think of my ss15-who once had all the same 'benefits" as my kids. in fact as little as approximately one year ago he had these benefits-but he wants to bitch and moan about how my kids are treated so much better. This is a kid who essentially failed the 9th grade because he refuses to do a lick of work, is on probation, smokes weed, and is unemployed. He believes because he exists as a child of my dh's that he is entitled to all sorts of privileges. It doesn't matter how many times he was told-that these are things you have to earn-it simply pissed him off.

I see lots of teens that do not care about school, don't care about getting a job, don't really care about anything. I also see a lot of 20 or 30 year old women with a couple of kids, on welfare, who still manage to get their weekly manicures and go to their tanning bed sessions all they while bitching because they don't get enough food stamps. They be calling up the food stamp office on their iphones bitching because they got cut 10.00 or something.