Halloween - is it worth a fight over?
I really can't make up my mind over this one, apathy is settling in but it still leaves a bad taste in my mouth, so I'd love some input from you all.
In my husbands parenting plan for SD7 Halloween is BM day every year (because she is essentially a 14 year old child). I was not brought up to celebrate Halloween and don't understand it or the mentality behind why adults enjoy it so much (kids I can understand get candy...why wouldn't they love it).
Last year my husband insisted on going out trick or treating with BM and SD because it was their "family tradition" (or some other vomit inducing sentiment). I got upset at him, but he still went anyway. This time last year I was dealing with a lot of shit and it was before I disengaged from BM in my life so I was generally not in a happy place.
This year, I have barely seen BM in 10 months and my life is 100 times better for it. I am in a much better place in my life in general.
I asked my husband what he was planning on doing for Halloween, he expressed that he wants to go trick or treating with SD and BM. He told me that it is because BM uses Halloween as an excuse to hang out with her friends and doesn't really interact with SD to ensure that she is having a good time and he feels bad for SD so he makes sure that he is focused on her enjoying herself.
So I can't decide whether this is a hill to die on or not. I have no other plans for Halloween that him going with them would interfere with. We have no other kids that he could be taking trick or treating. I am no longer so insecure that I worry about him and BM doing it together but at the same time there is still the whole sentiment/image of them being a family unit that I dislike but my husband is set on portraying for his SD (he paid for and attended a birthday party for SD with BM and her family this year, despite my protests that it was inappropriate).
Overall, I'm just not sure it is worth the effort of arguing. As much as I don't like the idea, I don't want to be arguing with my husband for a month over it.
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Comments
It was a hill to die on for
It was a hill to die on for me.
The first Halloween DH and I were together happened to fall on BM's time. He wanted to go out trick or treating with them. ALL of them, including BM. I said that was completely unacceptable. He didn't go. I think it was acceptable for me to lay out my boundaries about the way they interacted once we became a couple but I have to fight myself from feeling bad about that particular instance. The kids were already tweens at the time and that was the last Halloween that they actually wanted to go out trick or treating. He missed it and without a doubt, it was because of me. Focusing on the NEW CHAPTER in their lives has helped a lot though. We went to haunted houses together last year and they had never done that before with BM. DH gets to share THIS part of their lives with them and me now.
I did the whole arguing,
I did the whole arguing, getting upset and emotional and trying to set boundaries thing last year but it didn't do any good. He went anyway.
For the birthday party this year I just told him that I was upset that he was going to pay for and attend with BM and her family. I didn't get angry, arguing, upset with him but did let him know my feelings that I thought it was inappropriate but he still went anyway.
So I'm think what I'm saying is that I almost feel like giving up. I have tried to have boundaries and express those to my husband but beyond tying him up for the day I can't stop him going if is mind is set on it. So the only options I have are to just accept it and get on with my life or to fight it and get emotional and argue with him which will still lead nowhere as he will do what he wants.
But then again it seems sometimes that the only way to get through to him is to get emotional and upset because that is what he responds to, he'd rather have an easy life and if I don't argue with him at home and he placates BM by running around after her then his life is easy so every thing is a-ok.
Generally this is how the arguments go in my head, round and round in circles! I need to stop thinking sometimes!
There's another option. If he
There's another option. If he won't give you boundaries that you are comfortable with, get out of the situation before you're in any deeper. No sense in spending years playing 3rd wheel to him & BM.
In all other respects my
In all other respects my husband does well at maintaining boundaries and we have both certainly learnt a lot and built a lot of boundaries together over time.
Thanks for your sentiment, I understand how that is pretty much my only option other than put up with it if he won't change but I won't leave my husband because he mistakenly believes that his child will be forever damaged if he and BM don't celebrate her birthday and halloween together. I suppose I will just have to keep plugging on at him and hopefully eventually he will give it up.
Have you considered trying
Have you considered trying counseling? (screen your counselor WELL though. extremely well.)
Are you planning on kids of your own? Then what will happen?
We haven't been to
We haven't been to counseling. I'm not sure I want to fork out the money for one day of the year but am certainly not against it if we get to a point where it is needed in the future.
We are planning on having kids sometime in the next few years. I've no idea what will happen then on Halloween, I wrote a whole paragraph about it in my OP but deleted it because although it is a concern of mine, I'm not sure that it is a valid argument against him going with BM and SD this year that in the future we may have kids together and then he will have to work something different out.
I would definitely suggest
I would definitely suggest discussing this before you have kids. I went over several 'hypothetical' situations with DH before we agreed to TTC. Some may think it's crazy, but I didn't want to be arguing with a 1 year old kid on my hip fighting for him to have a somewhat normal life.
That's a good idea, I will
That's a good idea, I will bank that one and make sure we discuss hypothetical scenarios. I wish having my own child weren't a mine field of potential drama because of BM and SD, I am hoping the fairly large age difference when we get around to it will mitigate most differences between SD and any bios I have.
Totally agreed Lady... And
Totally agreed Lady... And this always crosses my mind when Dh wants to spend time with sd AND bm. If you guys were such good friends why the FU&K did you get divorced????
I would make it a HTDO. If it
I would make it a HTDO. If it was that important for him to be there, he should have put it in the CO or have the CO ammended so he has his DD every other year or something.
But idk, BM is a big PITA & causes a lot of drama. I may not feel that way if she wasn't so crazy.
THIS! I know you say you
THIS! I know you say you don't like BM, and are better when you don't have to see her/interact with her. But if my DH insisted on doing something like this with BM, you'd better believe I would be there.
Can I ask why SD7 Trick-or treating time couldn't be split? Why couldn't BM take her for an hour or 1.5 hours in her neighborhood, then you guys could take her for an hour in yours?
Agree! There are
Agree! There are soooooooooooo many options that DH can do with SD if its so important to him to see her dressed up.
This is a good idea. I will
This is a good idea. I will try it out on him, suggesting we do our own thing with SD as we will have her for the weekend anyway. I suspect that he will still insist on going, but it is worth a try and will help to get to the root of the real issue as to why he wants to go with them.
I think OP has previous
I think OP has previous problems with BM though, I'm guessing BM is very high conflict. Could very well ruin the time for everyone, including SD, if BM acts crazy.
It's hard in situations where people aren't normal.
DH could take SD to another trick-or-treat event. We have them the day before at the mall & a couple days before downtown in our city.
It seems to me if he cared so much about halloween, he would have had them alternate years in the CO.
If he cared that much about
If he cared that much about seeing SD on halloween, he shouldn't have agreed to let BM have every halloween.
I didn't mean to offend other
I didn't mean to offend other adults who like Halloween. I don't know you so I don't know your mental age. I know BM and her behavior and I am happy to assign her the mental age of 14.
Invite a boyfriend to go
Invite a boyfriend to go along and make a party out of it... It's all about prior relationships, right?
He He He
He He He
You have a very unique
You have a very unique situation. BM will not even lay eyes on my children. She's that crazy, that toxic.
I wish more than anything she was sane.
Holy crap, I never even
Holy crap, I never even though about that angle. Yeah, in my case, BM was telling everyone she knew that DH (SO at the time) was the most terrible human being on the planet. I saw their texts and emails, I saw her twisted sense of right and wrong, I saw her inflated sense of entitlement. I have no doubt that bigmouth was one of those kinds of people who made every minute of their divorce public (fb, etc). WHY would he even want to be anywhere near those people?!?
Thank you. I think you cured me from feeling bad about being the reason he missed the only year he had left trick or treating with them.
I would not only die on this
I would not only die on this hill, I would kill him and bury him on it as well.
I would never in a million years be ok with something like this. NEVER.
The fact that he is doing this to you is so disrespectful on so many levels. SMH...
"I would not only die on this
"I would not only die on this hill, I would kill him and bury him on it as well."
lol!
How old is this woman? What
How old is this woman? What is she doing on Halloween that takes away from her kid? Are they just going Trick or Treating? If so, even if she is all up her friends ass, cant SD7 handle getting the candy herself? I mean unless BM isnt watching SD, then okay I get it. Don't want her running around by herself. But I'm confused. What is BM so involved in that she cant keep on eye on her child going door to door?
Isnt Halloween just about candy? What is your DH doing to make it more enjoyable for SD, if he is there? Walking to each door with her?
BM is going to be there
BM is going to be there walking around with SD just with her friends there too I presume. I don't really know what my husband is talking about how he makes sure she is having a good time. I've never been trick or treating, I don't understand it or how kids can have a good time other than getting lots of candy and eating it...which they can do perfectly well on their own. And presumably if BM's friends are going then there will probably be other kids too, so SD would have kids to have fun with anyway.
I think I'm just as confused as you.
I'm so confused... LOL....
I'm so confused... LOL....
Just want to be ultra clear
Just want to be ultra clear here. I will not be going trick or treating with BM. I am fully disengaged from her, I have no desire to see her face, let alone put myself in the position of spending an afternoon walking around with her or vaguely near her. Those that can get along with their or their spouses ex "for the sake of the kids" you are either damned lucky to have nice, normal people in your lives or you are much more patient and forgiving than me, great job I wish we could all do that.
I will try talking to my husband about this again. I agree with most of you that it is inappropriate and disrespectful. I don't see why he has to make up for her inadequacies as a parent.
Also what confuses me is this argument of him wanting to make sure SD has a good time and that BM just hangs out with her friends I don't remember hearing last year.
If his excuse for having to
If his excuse for having to go is legit- it sounds more like a control issue on his end. He doesn't like what BM does/doesnt do for Trick or Treat, so he thinks he has to be there to make sure that SD has a good time. He cant trust BM to take care of it.
ETA- removed my last sentence since you answered it in my other post....
"family tradition". Okay
"family tradition". Okay stop right there. They are NOT a family anymore. They should not be doing things like this together. And it is not about SD having a good time. She is 7. She will get candy. She will have a good time.
I would die on this hill. DH needs to decide who is "family" is.
"She will get candy. She will
"She will get candy. She will have a good time."
Pretty much my thoughts. I think that him being there is more for him than her.
He told me that it is because
He told me that it is because BM uses Halloween as an excuse to hang out with her friends and doesn't really interact with SD to ensure that she is having a good time and he feels bad for SD so he makes sure that he is focused on her enjoying herself.
I call bullshit on this one. This is perhaps one of the most ridiculous reasons for going trick or treating with an ex I have ever heard. I've taken BS4 trick or treating every year, I freaking LOVE Halloween, always have. We drive to a friend's neighborhood (since we live out in the sticks) and friend and I and BS4 walk around. DH has never gone, Halloween is take it or leave it for him. Trust me, BS4 could give two craps that DH is not there.... I don't need to "interact" with BS4 to "ensure" that he has a good time. I mean what does your DH think BM needs to be doing to "interact" with SD?? You walk down the road, look for lights that are on and knock on the damn door and say Trick or Treat, Thank you and walk away, then repeat until it's time to go.
It's fine if your DH loves Halloween and doesn't want to miss out on the night.... BUT to give you this asinine excuse for his reason to go? THAT is what is not cool to me.
glad to here it isn't just me
glad to here it isn't just me that doesn't understand this. I've not been trick or treating before so I didn't know if I had the wrong view of halloween but I thought it was pretty much as simple as you say. dress up, walk around, knock on doors, kid gets candy = kid has a good time. It is good to hear from someone experienced that it isn't any more complicated than that.
BM can get the hell over it,
BM can get the hell over it, and skid will survive
This is the part that bothers me though.... the way I read it BM doesn't give a flying fuck whether dad is there or not, she apparently has a tradition of going with her friends. And obviously the 7 year old is NOT going to care whether dad is there as long as she is wearing her costume and getting candy.
Hell I know a TON of kids in INTACT families who don't have BOTH parents go trick or treating with them (my family included! DH never goes with us, BIL never goes with SIL and her kids, etc)
This is poster's DH WANTING to go but giving some lame ass reason trying to insinuate that BM and SD7 NEED him there. It's bullshit. I hate being bullshitted.
I think he just doesn't want
I think he just doesn't want to miss out on this part of her childhood. I can totally understand this. I really don't believe it has to do with BM at all. I really don't think this is a hill to die on.
Where I have a problem with all of this is that he isn't listening to you. He isn't taking your feelings into consideration. Somewhere there has to be a compromise.
Sit down with him and tell him you want to talk about how this makes you feel and discuss options so that he can watch his daughter trick-or-treat while at the same time not disrespecting your feelings.
Maybe he can talk to BM and see if she'll agree to switch every other year or as someone else said, she has an hour and he has an hour.
I am going to try this, or
I am going to try this, or suggesting that he takes her to another halloween event on another day (I didn't realize they existed so that is a good idea). However I have a suspicion that it is not really that he doesn't want to miss out, more that he has the ludicrous idea that SD needs both her parents present at important events otherwise she will be damaged forever.
She managed just fine last year having two Christmases in different houses, so I'm sure she will be fine with two Halloweens. Now just got to persuade my husband!
Halloween isn't as big an
Halloween isn't as big an event where I'm from as it is in the US. I dressed up and went to a couple of parties when I was a kid, but generally no one went trick or treating. You can't miss something you have never done. It wasn't a part of my childhood so I have no emotional connection to it. I have never really enjoyed the whole costume thing in any context, so that and going around knocking on random peoples doors has no appeal to me. Much as having to hand out candy to kids I've never met before has no appeal to me.
I am going to try out the
I am going to try out the idea of him doing something separate out on him. I think at the very least it will bring out what his real issues are.
"Where I have a problem with
"Where I have a problem with all of this is that he isn't listening to you. He isn't taking your feelings into consideration."
^^^^THIS^^^^
Underneath all of the
Underneath all of the information you've provided, I feel your husband isn't being honest.
All of the reasons he's given for wanting to go trick-or-treating with SD and BM could be resolved by doing something else special with just SD or with you and SD.
So what's really going on?
I have the same suspicions as
I have the same suspicions as you. I think that he feels SD will be damaged if he and BM don't do any 'family' things together and that she should have both her parents present for some events/activities. He thinks that it is normal and healthy for them to do things together.
It's NOT normal and healthy
It's NOT normal and healthy for a kid to have a false sense of "family" Your DH and BM are no longer a "family" so why pretend that they are? I'll never understand why people think this is a good idea??
I have no idea, to me it
I have no idea, to me it makes no sense.
But again I always feel inexperienced as I'm not a child of divorce myself but he is. Although his parents didn't divorce until he was a teenager so he was more able to understand what was going on. But SD7 doesn't show any signs really of negative affects of divorce, though that is probably because she gets to go trick or treating with dad and mom together every year, if we take that away she will need intensive therapy for years to come!
This is my point, and THIS
This is my point, and THIS is what would have me fired up. His reason for NEEDING to go is dumb, and is obviously fabricated. Why can't he just say "I really like Halloween and I'd be sad if I didn't go"
This makes a lot of sense.
This makes a lot of sense. I'm going to think on it. Thank you.