Financial Secrets
For the past couple of years I have been a regular reader of ST. After reading something especially shocking or sad, I often wonder what the outcome is and the writer disappears.
My relationship with my husband has really improved during the lockdown and isolation. We relocated to a property outside the city which I had to sell to my sister for financial reasons. It has been just the two of us (mostly) for the last 9 months and we have gotten a lot closer. We continue to see his son and the grandkids intermittantly. I am trying to deal with my resentment toward them in therapy. It is helping a bit.
I finally declared bankruptcy for my company this month. After 34 years of running a successful business this was certainly not the way that I had wanted to end my career. However, a series of events, including Covid, gave me no other choice. I am just hoping that some of the creditors won't go after me personally.
My fear of the future was based on signing a one-sided prenup and my change in financial circumstances. My husband refuses to talk to me about money. Everything financial is a secret. Does anyone else experience this? I can't penetrate this brick wall.
Our finances are totally separate. He hides all of his financial papers and goes into another room when he talks to his financial advisor or his son about money. He gives me no money whatsoever although he subsidizes his only son's lavish lifestyle. They have joint bank accounts and investements and every year he gifts him substantial amounts of money. Instead of actually "giving" his son money, he pays large chunks of his son's enourmous mortgage. How do I know this? I snoop through his papers.. Through my snooping, I found that he has made changes in his will. If something happens to him, he has left me enough money that I will be okay. Even if his son kicks me out of the apartment, I will have enough for a decent rental.
Finding this has greatly eased my anxiety. What I don't understand is why EVERYTHING financial, even things that would make me feel more secure during this very difficult time for me, is such a secret. It is really destructive to our marriage. I try When I try to discuss it with him he just stonewalls.
I would like to hear from others what your experience is and what I can do?
How long have you been
How long have you been married? It makes no sense to me why a husband and wife wouldn't talk about and share their future plans, especially if they've been together for a long time. Naturally the longer you're together, the more what one does affects the other...even with separate finances.
I'd take comfort in the fact that I'm provided for...but would also be troubled and confused about why my DH wouldn't want me to know that. Very strange.
the fact is...in most states spouses can't cut each other out of the will after a marriage of a certain length. Find out what the laws are in your state!
Dear Two of Us:
We have been married for almost 10 years and together for 15. My financial circumstances were very different when we met, married, and for most of our marriage. I was financially independent, has my own assets, and ran my own company. Unfortunately I am in a very different situation now. I am sure that his financial advisors have made him aware that I could probably contest both the prenup and his will if he didn't provide for me. I know what he is doing is giving his son most of his assets so that there will be very little to fight over and giving me enough so that I won't fight over it. I knew he had more money than I had from the very beginning. What I didn't know until the day we signed the prenup was how much money he had and how secretive he is about money. His son lives a lavish lifestyle on HIS money and we live comfortably and adequately. It is really disturbing that after 15 years, and the life we share together that he keeps secrets from me.
He keeps secrets
that isnt healthy in a marriage, but you know that.
Makes you wonder, always wondering what goes on behind closed doors. The private chit chats. This leads to no trust . Must make it hard to enjoy the good, because this will always be there in the back of your mind.
F that!
Are there any parts of joint
Are there any parts of joint finances that you manage? Like...is there even a joint account for groceries and household items? For utilities? or is everything kept completely separate in every way?
What kind of support have you provided him over the past 15 years? How have you saved him money? By cooking? Cleaning? "Helping out" with his business? Helping with child care in any way? It seems as though the son may have still been a minor when you met?
I'm asking because usually pre-nups only apply to the assets accumulated prior to the marriage...not to additional contributions made during the marriage and, sometimes, not to the growth or appreciation of the assets.
If he's trying to divest his estate without your consent...it could be that he's giving away money that you have a legal right to...even without the forced pre-nup being invalidated.
I don't normally advise couples to go behind each others' backs, but if he's as secretive and shady as he sounds...it may be the best course for you. Take that pre-nup and a copy of the will (take pics on your phone if you have to) as well as all of your financial info and get to a shark of a lawyer. See what you're reasonably entitled to vs what he's leaving you and decide from there if you think it's worth a fight.
For now, if there is a joint account for shopping and you're the primary shopper for the family...start getting out an extra $20 each trip and stashing it away. It won't make a huge difference and it won't help you retire...but it might make you feel a little better to have a sneaky secret of your own :-)
Strange
If you've signed a pre-nup than what is he afraid of you knowing? I would not find this acceptable at all to be honest. My SO and I are not married but know each other's finances. We have 'ours' and 'our own' money accounts. He knows the house is mine. He knows I won't pay a dime towards his adult children or alimony to his ex-wife. I don't question how much he gives his kids, and don't care, but I know overall he is in shape for other joint goals we have for our future together. We have Living Trusts in place to take care of each other. I would not feel secure nor trust a partner who kept everything such a secret.
FYI for New York:
FYI for New York:
https://www.meyer-spencer.com/can-my-spouse-disinherit-me-under-new-york...
It may be that your husband has you in the will but for less than you'd get if you claimed an elective share. Possible if his assets are extensive. My dad was a corporate attorney and did many, many wills over the years. He often advised parents who didn't want to leave anything to one of the kids (usually for drug and alcohol-related reasons) to leave them the same portion but in a trust with a trustee they felt was reliable...or to leave the kid a token amount so they couldn't claim they were forgotten or left out unintentionally and file with probate for their elective share.
I've actually done this in our wills. DH wanted mirror wills leaving everything to the other spouse. In our case, we've spent over a decade building up a business together...it was just becoming really profitable in 2019...and now we'll see what happens in 2020-2021 :-/
However, DH's parents are REALLY wealthy...and still alive. When we did our wills 6 or 7 years ago, I told him we should put the skids in. He said no at first. In his mind...and what he said aloud...was: "I don't want you sacrificing, helping with CS, building this business...and then I die in a freak accident and my kids get my life insurance, get a piece of what we've built up together, AND get to inherit directly from my parents and become millionaires in their 30's while you get cut out...why should you lose any of what you've built...?"
Then I explained elective share and how the skids (or, reallly, their greedy BM, could come after me for a bigger share on their behalf bc they were minors.)
At that, DH agreed to a token amount to protect me. Now that the skids are all adults and I'm the life insurance beneficiary, we should probably revisit the wills and see if we should decrease that token percentage. When his parents pass and he inherits...we should probably set some of that aside specifically for skids and revisit the wills again.
Apologies for the long-winded reply. My point in all this...wills and inheritance is complicated, and there's no one-size-fits all cookie cutter solution. Even within one family, circumstances change, needs change, and wills should be revisited at least every 10 years or after any major life change (such as a business going bankrupt.)
My advice: get to a financial adviser and/or inheritance attorney stat and understand your rights as a spouse. Also...stop tiptoeing around and allowing your DH to be secretive. Address this directly and often until you get a response.
This would not be a marriage
This would not be a marriage I could stay in. Either he trusts you or he doesn't, and clearly he doesn't. Though I wouldn't have married him in the first place if he had this level of secrecy about money.
I wonder if keeping financial
I wonder if keeping financial secrets gives your DH some sense of power? It's an odd behavior, and one potetially harmful to you. Has he kept other secrets, that you're aware of? It really sounds like a power play to me -- keeping you outside the circle for some reason.
And I'm sorry about the bankruptcy. I hope you can focus on your 34 years of success.
Thanks for your good advice....
I agree that secrets are very destructive to a relationship. I am not making excuses for his bad behavior, but knowing him as I do, I think it is very deep seated in his family history. His mother lived under a false identity during WWII and probably passed this kind of secrecy and keeping everything closely within blood relatives on to her children. (I never met the Mom as she was gone before I met my husband.) I have already been to the top matrimonial lawyer in my city. As sneaky as he is, everything he has done behind my back is in compliance with the law. Due to my financial situation, I can no longer afford to go to top lawyers. I am putting all of this out there in the hope that people won't make the same mistake as I did. When you are presented with an unreasonable prenup two weeks before the wedding please know THIS IS THE REAL PERSON YOU ARE MARRYING. CALL THE WEDDING OFF UNTIL YOU CAN COME TO AN AGREEMENT. It took me years to forgive myself for making this mistake out of love and trust.
As we all know, no one is perfect. However, after the bankruptcy is resolved and I can come up for air, I will decide if this behavior is something I can continue to live with. As much as I would like it to change I don't think it is going to.
We all see things in our
We all see things in our rearview mirror that weren't evident at first. Don't beat yourself up -- you made the best decisions you could with the facts and emotions at hand. And now you need strength to move forward. Fortunately, it sounds like you ARE strong and resilient.
Keep us posted.
NYC...
This is a great example to live by and believe the phrase....when people show you who they are, believe them! It would save so much grief for so many, many people.
I genuinely hope your husband has provided adequately for you in hindsight. I would assume it is pretty difficult for him to do so with sonny boy in his ear and accounts.
Live well!