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A few things I want to discuss at counseling...and looking for other opinions

hangingbyathread6's picture

As I wrote in my last update, I had a very clear and concise discussion with DH regarding his behavior and attitude towards ME. Since then, I will say he has been better...but we also don't have his boys this week and that is usually when things are calm and peaceful anyway...no brats to cause issues, and MIL is too busy keeping up with the boys and BM since that's where they are this week.

I have been thinking a lot about our relationship, marriage and family. How things aren't what we thought they would be, there has been damage (both by SS and DH)and I really don't believe SS will change at all with the continued influence of BM and MIL. So I have some things I want to bring up in counseling and shift the course the counseling has been going. I'm wondering if any of you out there have opinions or your own experiences with these situations and what you think about them. I will state, I really do not want to hear to get divorced as although I have divorced once (due to rampant infidelity and financial issues caused due to those behaviors) I never intended to divorce and I do think that marriage is hard work, it's not a fairy tale and should be worked on rather than "let's just get the papers and be done" So please, some helpful and constructive opinions and thoughts would be appreciated.

First, there are not clear boundaries in our marriage and there needs to be. I feel that DH needs to address the meddling by his mother directly with her, lay down the guidelines, and enforce them. MIL called or received calls from SS12's phone FIFTEEN just on Friday alone...this is usually on S14's phone but since his is gone, SS14 and MIL are utilizing SS12's phone (until I stopped it on Saturday)I think DH needs to say the following to MIL:
1.- SS14 is MY son and I will discipline him as necessary. It is not your place to comment on discipline to SS14 to SS, myself, or my wife, or BM.
2.- SS14 is a child, he is your grandson, he is NOT your confidante, BFF, or shoulder to cry/lean on. Adult situations are NOT to be discussed with my son. My son does not and should not need to know about any tension or situations between you and I, or you and my wife. You are not to discuss my wife with my son. You are grandma. Period.
3.- Although I understand you may want to speak to my son, the number of times you are calling him is over the top. He is 14 and needs to be 14. Your relationship with him is not healthy...for either of you. One phone call a day or even every other is acceptable. You are not to call him to check on how he is doing and if he is in trouble or if he has bitches to voice about his SM or me to you. If that's what he is doing, your response is to be, "you need to discuss this with your father"
4.- hanging is my wife. I do not want to listen to you bad mouth her. I do not want to hear your opinion of her. The two of you have issues, that is between the two of you. If you want a relationship with me and my sons, you will respect my marriage and my wife. You do not need to be best friends, but you will be cordial and polite to her. And she will do the same to you (side note: I have...I just don't engage her regularly which results in the comments to DH that your wife hates me, and to SS)
5.- As I mentioned, hanging is my wife, not BM. Anything that has to do with MY life with hanging and our family is not for you to relay to BM. After everything that woman has done to me, your son, and my sons I don't appreciate you having any relationship with her, but that's your choice, just leave me and my life and family out of it.

Second, as for BM, although things have simmered down with her since the letter that she is to have no contact with me, and all communication is to be via text I want to DH to assert to her (and file the necessary paperwork if needed....which it will be) that she is to uphold her responsibility to the skids. Her half of extra curriculars, or they won't play. Her child support. Her responsibility for transport of skids. And to address the parental alienation BM is feeding skids about DH and myself. This all will require a mediation request with the FOC but he needs to do it.

Third, an understanding needs to come between DH and I that I will not be held responsible for skids and their behavior. I will not be responsible for taking skids anywhere unless I offer to do so. I will not be responsible for them as long as they continue to treat me as a non person in the home. DH needs to explain this to skids and inform them that they are to respect our home and his wife.

Fourth, and this is a big one and will probably cause some tension between DH and I...I want to separate our checking acct. I would like to keep the joint one, and we each put half of the monthly expenses for our household (mortgage, vehicle pmt, insurance, utilities, food) in that account and the extra we have goes into separate accounts. We can each spend the excess money we have however we so choose without the other having any issues about it. I feel this is best since we have five kids and my skids expect and want everything and I'm often the bad guy for saying no. I make more money than my DH and I get a good amount of child support for my kids. He lets his ex off the hook easily and I am tired of footing her bill. I know this has so many viewpoints and I would like to hear how others have handled it and what has or has not worked for you. Keep in mind we have primary custody of both sets of kids, so we are the majority household for all five.

Anon2009's picture

"If you want a relationship with me and my sons, you will respect my marriage and my wife."

Be careful on this one. If mil ends up not respecting you she'll likely go to bm to have a relationship with sks and bm will allow it.

hangingbyathread6's picture

MIL already has a relationship with BM. The BM who MIL couldn't stand and was a worthless POS excuse for a mother (MIL's words), until DH and I moved in together and got engaged. Then, they were buddy buddy, and MIL relays everything that goes on in my home to BM. They have coffee chats where they discuss the evil wicked SM who holds kids accountable and follows through with consequences etc etc.

So I have no fear regarding MIL going to BM for a relationship...that already is happening...and it's sickening that a mother would throw her own son under the bus like that. BM has said horrible, awful lies about DH abusing her, and not supporting his kids, not supporting her (he has custody...always has...she is supposed to pay support, and he has never laid a hand on her..she on the other hand is abusive, I've witnessed it and been the subject of it) She recently tried to land DH in jail and lose his custody by filing a false abuse report with CPS that was dismissed. She is an evil, evil woman who wants to live off child support and the welfare system and have everything handed to her...and it drives her crazy that we have a comfortable lifestyle...that's because I have a profession...and worked my ass of to get here.

moeilijk's picture

The points are good, necessary even. I suggest you consider how strongly you feel DH needs to make 'announcements' to others about changes. From what you've said in the past (if I recall you correctly), your DH is a hot-head who will say anything in the heat of the moment and then forget it, or expect you to. He's also prone to revising history to make his words/actions someone else's fault.

It might be wise to have him agree with you what he's going to do, then you'll see his character as he does/doesn't change his ways. He'll also make a more powerful statement with the co-dependents in his life when he just changes things - they're used to him talking and nothing coming of it. And he will have to prove his new habits over time, so he won't be able to flip next week and say you 'forced' him into something.

hangingbyathread6's picture

I feel strongly that he calmly have a conversation with his mother. This is important and will not cease without being addressed. He needs to lay the line down in the sand and let her know what is and is not appropriate, and yes, he does need to follow through...things to be discussed in counseling.

As for BM, I'm fine with him just requesting the mediation with FOC and go from there. But at least he is taking steps to address it.

The separate money issue....sigh...kind of a big one for me...how has this worked for others?

moeilijk's picture

I don't have experience with separate money myself.

notthemomma does, if her blogs are up give them a read. It is the only thing that keeps her sane as her DH is careless with money, does not pay his fair share, and expects her to pay all expenses for their child together while he pays for fun stuff for himself and her (mostly grown) SDs.

But for many other couples, it works more positively than just avoiding bankruptcy.

I think it's important to find the 'fair' that works for your partnership. Fair is not blended finances right now, because trust has been eroded and responsibility has not been shown.

AllySkoo's picture

DH and I keep separate checking accounts as well, and each have our "own" bills we pay. It definitely works better for us too. Make sure that if you have the joint checking for common bills and you have separate ones for "your" money that you also BOTH contribute to some sort of savings or retirement fund. (DH and I do those separately too, but there's really no reason you can't do a joint one if you want.)

As for you not being responsible for the skids, that's totally reasonable and well within your rights.

The other 2 I'm a bit more dubious about. Yes, it would be great if DH dealt with his mom and BM and made a big announcement about supporting you and what he expects from each woman. Unfortunately, I don't think anything would change even if he did that. MIL and BM are both sort of toxic people, and telling toxic people to knock it off already seldom works. I think your DH knows that - which means the only way to actually give you what you're asking for is to cut his mom out of his life (the consequence of her not changing, which she won't), and I can see him balking at that.

I don't know. Worth talking to him about, I suppose, but remember that he can't control his mom (or BM), only himself. Maybe figure out more what you want HIM to do (or not do) and ask for that? I don't mean "When your Mom crosses the line I expect you to tell her..." because "telling" her anything is an exercise in futility and you'll all just end up mad and frustrated. Maybe "When your mom calls SS's phone more than 2 times in a day I expect you to block her number from the phone for 24 hours." Something more like that, you know? Something he can actually do and control.

hangingbyathread6's picture

I hear ya AllySkoo...and that's what I mean. My point is just you need to respect my wife and family and your behavior with SS is inappropriate (the discussing adult situations with him) and the non stop phone calls, I don't necessarily mean he needs to make an announcement all out of the blue, I just mean when MIL or BM calls and starts things that those are the types of responses they get from him. MIL calls to spew about me being the evil SM for enforcing the consequence, DH says "We are the parents, and we will discipline as we see fit. It is not your place to try to tell me how to raise my children." Or "if you are only calling to trash my wife, then perhaps you should call me another time. She is my wife and I choose to not carry on conversations with people who are only trying to smear her" those kind of things...along those lines...not a walk in to MIL's house and alright... It was just those are the POINTS I want to see support in. When those things occur.

Thanks for all the advice and input!! I appreciate it!

AllySkoo's picture

Ah, I gotcha. So it's less about telling his mom what to do, and more about telling his mom he's not going to engage in her BS. THAT makes total sense and you should definitely bring that up in counseling. It's one thing to demand your DH change someone else's behavior, that's not truly possible. But it is completely within his control to tell him mom when she starts in "I'm not listening to this. We can discuss something else but I'm not having this conversation with you."

Rags's picture

I think having a strategy of what you expect to come from your work with a therapist is great. The therapist works for you and should be held to your expectations and goals for the fees you are paying the therapist.

Sure, the therapist may push back on a few things and give you some guidance in a direction other than what you are wanting on a few things. You are paying not only for results but for their advice, guidance and expertise.

I insisted on therapy for my XW and I when we were entering the death throws of our marriage. Interestingly we improved greatly for many months of therapy. Right up until we started addressing what ultimately turned out to be the primary issue (her issue) and fatal element of our marriage.

Even though the marriage failed the counseling was a great investment of my time and money. I kept seeing the therapist who was instrumental in helping me reconnect with the person I enjoyed being and who I had lost touch with during my time with my adulterous whore of an XW.

I would advise exactly what you have planned, an alignment discussion with your DH and the therapist as you have outlined in your OP in your next session so that your expectations are clearly stated and your DH and the therapist can align with your expectations and inject their perspectives and goals so you can all move forward with a plan.

hangingbyathread6's picture

It went alright I guess. We didn't get into all of the things I have to discuss but we did talk about the need for boundaries both for our marriage and for me setting my own. I know counseling is a fix...and I know it takes time, and I want to do it, but sometimes I think...darn it why can't it feel like we are getting a few steps ahead...sigh.